sailingfun

What surprises me in this industry is how intelligent pilots take such a short term view career wise. The number one priority should be the financial stability of the companies you are considering for employment. In that regard ranking the airlines should be SWA, DAL, with AMR and UAL a big drop tied for third. SWA's balance sheet is as good as it gets. Delta is good but still carrying a hefty off the books pension debt.
There is nothing wrong with the 737 that a noise canceling headset can't fix so really not a huge issue. If you enjoy flying it's a lot more fun than the bus. The big advantage Delta has is making it ⅔'s of the way up the seniority list is as good or better than the top of the list at SWA. You have multiple career tracks you can switch in and out of at will and the equipment changes often build some great long term downtime into schedules. Just last month I listened to a copilot who could be in the top 25% as a CA on any narrow body in his base ***** about how bad things were at Delta and how he would be so much better off at SWA as he would be a CA there. I said why don't you bid Ca at Delta and he said "I don't want to fly a narrow body and do 3 legs a day". Oh well, go figure!

TED74

What surprises me in this industry is how semi-intelligent pilots can claim to know what everyone else's number one priority should be.

aa73

Thank you, may I have another!

737 is a great airplane. Obviously if you compare it to a 75/76/77/airbus cockpit it's tiny but that's what perspective does to ya.

737 is built well, flies well, and most importantly of all, requires PILOTING skills that keep you in the loop. A winning combination in my book. I'll gladly stay on it my entire career flying domestic turns.

full of luv

Lemme guess, your less than 6' tall....

Not that there's anything wrong with that!

Whereisalpa

Listen I'm 6'4" and other than the yoga stepping over the and around the center counsel, I love this jet. Most guys do look like they should be riding at Churchill Downs but if I can get in the seat anybody can!! I have the Bose A20 and will ride this jet till I retire..... Hopefully with a reinstated retirement just like the boys at UPS!!!! How do you like that Seaslap!!!!! Hahahahahaha

GogglesPisano

Getting into the 717 seat is even harder.

Trip7

I'm 5'11 165lbs. The 737 Center Console is pretty narrow so I found it to have more leg room to the inside vs other planes. To the outside the window is right there so that's the major negative. Still, I had no issues flying that bird 4-5 hours. Plenty of room. JMHO though....YMMV

sourdough44

I'd lean Delta, though individual particulars would factor in heavily.

BobZ

same here. 6'4" and the bose is magic stuff.

hated the -200. liked the NG a lot more once I concluded I was dealing with a 5 year old. cant ask it to do anything too quickly. cant ask it to do anything too complicated.

and cant ask it to do anything, without expecting it to wander around a bit getting it done.

if the delta crystal ball ever decides to put an AB in base I would likely bid it.....but only to add the type to what is otherwise all Boeings.

RJSAviator76

Man, the hate for the 737 is something else... Nothing that can't be cured with Bose A20. Also, there's the same thread over in the Southwest forum if anyone wants to chime in over there as well.

Southwest vs Delta

Here's my reply that was also on that thread, with some edit that maybe someone else may find useful as well.

Congratulations!!

As a Southwest pilot, I'll echo the previous posts - if you live in one carrier's base, go with that base. That cannot be overstated enough.

Here's what I see at Southwest:

Flexibility with your schedule can be fantastic even as a junior line holder. The reason I say 'can be' is because we cannot just drop trips. We can put them in giveaway and we're on the hook until someone picks them up. We can, however, trade with the company, and most of the time I won't fly a single one of my original trips. I'll rearrange my entire schedule even as a junior line holder with relative ease. In other words, I can usually get quite a few weekends off as a junior guy through our trading with the company (ELITT). Same goes with our trips... I can find high-time, super efficient trips, or 2 legs a day legacy-type schedules, transcons, international or pure domestic...

Pay-wise, gotta compare apples to apples. You'll make more at Delta if you're chasing the quickest upgrade. But, there's a reason why 6000 other pilots pass on that upgrade. If you live there, it ends up being a no-brainer. As an FO, from what I gather on apples-to-apples comparison, Delta makes more on a per-hour basis, but on days-away-from-home, SWA probably makes more simply on account of our flying being structured more productively. Some guys focus squarely on per-hour basis, while others look at the time away from home vs. final pay stub. I don't know how much ability to make extra junior pilots have at Delta, but here at SWA, if you want to work, you can work and make more, right up to FAR 117 limits, but all your choice. I've seen 2nd year FO's make north of $200k averaging 170-180 TFP working their butts off and having no life, to the guys only flying their 13 days a month making a tad over 120k and enjoying plenty of time at home or even have a whole other career on the side, and everything in between. I work a bit more than an average pilot, but I also manage to enjoy time off and I'm looking to finish my 2nd year around $170-175k gross not counting any retirement or per diem in those figures, working about 17-19 days a month and spending only about 6-9 nights away from home during that month, depending on what I end up picking up.

Medical insurance - I'm pretty happy with Regular Plan at SWA. I don't pay any monthly premiums. My deductible is $300 dollars for the year and max out of pocket is $2500 for the family. Downside - this particular plan doesn't cover preventative medicine. But then again, not paying any monthly premiums can pay a lot of that preventative medicine. We have other plans as well, there's a whole other thread about it.

Loss of license/short term/long term disability is where I think we lack the most among the big carriers. My biggest problem with our current plan is that the company dumps your medical coverage after about a year (someone please correct me if I'm wrong), and the union ends up paying your COBRA payments. You and your family also lose your travel benefits too even on Southwest. You have to ask your Chief Pilot for a pass and though they're usually very good about it, it's wrong and you should never have to deal with that. There has been some progress on the travel front, but it still lags substantially behind our peers. Judging by what I'm seeing and hearing, this is one of the biggest things to fix in any future contract negotiations.

Job security - well, the company brags about never having laid off a single employee. They haven't laid off anyone after 9/11, or the Great Recession, or after Airtran merger. They almost did at one point, but ended up not to and still retaining that record. I like our scope clause better than the other big 3. I would royally chap my rearend to see a Southwest Express EMB-175 or some other subcontracting entity flying our passengers, but that's normal at Delta, and United and American for that matter. Something to also pay attention to particularly regarding international flying at Delta would be their joint ventures with foreign carriers. One thing I'd mention here is that both the union and the company told our newhire class that in order to run our current schedule using Delta's rules and contract, we'd need something like 2500 pilots on the property overnight. Think about if/when the economy tanks. Makes you think... but overall, Southwest runs a pretty lean ship.

Upgrade time... well, depends who you ask and even more importantly, depends on your preferences. Are you willing to be the plug captain or you want to hold out for a particular base or perhaps want to hold out for a line holding captain position? Here's where I'm going with this... if you read this board, people will tell you it'll take 15 years to upgrade. If it takes you 15 years, it's most likely due to your own preferences. Current junior captain upgrades are right at 10 year mark. Given the hiring and staffing numbers the company is talking about, and the timeline to achieve those numbers (12,000 pilots in 2022), if they stick to that plan, I'd say you'd be looking at the earliest upgrade in 6-7 years. Bear in mind that the current plug captain is sitting at 61% total seniority. Now, if you want to wait, and a number of people do.... it'll take you longer. It's all timing. People hired in the last couple of years have had a tremendous upward movement, and it's forecast to continue providing the economy doesn't take a major nose-dive. Someone hired in the first half of 2016 has moved up over 1,000 numbers if that gives you any perspective.

In parting shots, it really boils down to you and what your preferences are... if you want to fly a heavy, don't come here... no telling what the future holds. Personally, if I lived in a Delta domicile, I'd go to Delta. If you live in a Southwest domicile, go to Southwest. If you live in Atlanta, go to Delta - it'll be years before you see it at Southwest. One cannot stress enough how much different this job is when you simply drive to work. Think of it this way... a commuter will fly a 13-day line, but he'll spend maybe 15-17 days away from home. He will still only make 13 days worth of pay, and also pay for hotels in their domicile. You live in domicile, and if you choose to work 15-17 days, you'll make tens of thousands of dollars more per year being gone the same amount of time as a commuter working only their schedule; or you can have that much better quality of life and have that much more time off at home. The beauty of it is that the choice is yours.

Good luck with your decision. It's a great problem to have.