Originally Posted by Bucking Bar

Good point.


To prepare for negotiations the FIRST job is to understand the company's business going forward. What are the revenue flows? What are the arrangements with partners? What is "Delta flying", what is under Delta management's control and what obligations has the company already made, arrangements so central to the product we produce that they are inviolate.

We had emotion-driven negotiations during a very profitable time which got us nothing.

We had need-based negotiations during an existential pandemic which netted good results; job security, safety, more time off, better seniority and pay.

Our recent gains were harder than they needed to be. We have elected ALPA Representatives who fed the emotional grievances of self-entitled pilots who even went so far as to champion the furloughs of our own members.

If we give in to the laziness of emotional reaction we will stagnate, Delta will move on without us and perhaps eventually get to "me too" on United or American. If we can continue to build on the transactional arrangement we have benefitted from during COVID we might actually lead the industry again. Perhaps we can negotiate our rightful share (Delta's flying) of a well-positioned international travel conglomerate.

Originally Posted by boog123

Do better and we would still have people in those spots. Remember the saying about brown nosing and butt kissing, depth perception....you do have a talent.

Originally Posted by JamesBond

More should read and digest this part of your post. I have heard guys talking about a 6 hour duty day. I can guarantee you that there will be trips... one that comes to mind are the South America trips because of the 30 hour layover that will be absolutely trashed if that kind of thing comes to fruition. Can you say min layover rocket? Yeah it will be productive, but hardly restful and certainly no fun.

Originally Posted by NuGuy

I would also add that maybe the way those people did those jobs caused "Delta fatigue"....

Originally Posted by notEnuf

We need a non-con match. If the company grants an across the board raise, say 4% (the amount we are presently behind) the pilots get it too. Only fair considering they got our profit sharing. BTW, 4% retro to the amendable date is baked into my expectation.

Originally Posted by sailingfun

From reading your past posts your expectations for a raise in this contract seemed far higher. I was thinking 8 was reasonable followed by 4 and 4. Why the change?

Originally Posted by notEnuf

That's not a change, that's in addition to. Least we forget the hole we are already in. I'm more like 12-4-4-and match indefinitely until the next PWA is signed. And that's just pay rates...

Originally Posted by sailingfun

So no full retro?

Originally Posted by notEnuf

Where do you get that from my post? Of course full retro.