Seconded!
...

 

What can I say, I'm most happy when I'm being pessimistic :-)

With the reductions that are currently going on in the 50 seat market at Delta all ALPA has to do is codify these reductions that the company is already making and plans to continue to make and they could call that a "WIN" and say they have "improved the balance of flying."

In reality they would have done nothing since Delta was already doing it. If there is no reduction in large permitted aircraft (the once that have limits and whose CASM threatens Mainline) then ALPA will have achieved nothing.

I, like you, have read over the opener several times and I'm not that disappointed in it with few exceptions, but Section one written in such a way that it sounds like we don't really want to "rock the boat."

Here is compensation: Significantly increase hourly rates of pay

Here is what scope should have been:

Significantly reduce the outsourcing of Delta Pilots jobs.

Seek to the maximum extent possible to have Delta Pilot fly Delta's planes and passengers.

I would have like to see Night Pay in there as well as Hazard Pay for some of our layover cities.

vpr

 

As part of this work up to C2012, members of various regional MEC's were bought in and taken to school on "Delta Economics." One of the points made to the Comair Reps was that they needed to take concessions. Obviously that presentation was not instigated by the "regionals" or "national."

 

Bar,

I just read the C2K scope section and I kind of wonder if Delta is headed toward the C2K numbers right now. In 2004 C2K would have allowed up to 37% of mainline block hours outsourced to DCI with 39% allowed based on the bad economy.

IMO the 37% was to high but I find it interesting that based on what Delta has been doing parking the 50 seaters, that were over bought, we could end up at close to 39% without doing anything.

I agree 100% with you that Delta pilots should fly ALL delta passengers however if that is not attainable I like the idea of a:
1. Total Aircraft Permitted Limit
2. Large Aircraft Permitted Limit
2. Block Hour Percentage Limit
3. An Available Seat Mile Limit

(All of the above should significant reductions from current levels)

I know that these limits were changed or given away subsequent to C2K but I don't think that they were the reason for the losses suffered after 911.

 

And your talking points are written by the donuts..

Same song.. different verse.

 

VPR,

The core of the issue is, "Why do we allow outsourcing at all ?"

Block hour percentages are like the alcoholic at the bar saying "I'll have one more and quit."

In our case, we have partnered with management in the outsourcing business. As Moak described it, we need DCI to make lots of money, so Delta makes lots of money, so we make lots of money. When Delta was threatened by economic turmoil, our union's first response was to allow more outsourcing to try to keep the ship afloat. ( this is why Tim Caplinger and roughly 2,000 pilots from NWA and Delta were furloughed )

What I propose is a more common sense approach. Delta pilots do Delta flying at competitive pay rates for equipment (big airplanes make big money, small airplanes make less money).

 

The productivity argument. If ya'll wanna continue with that one, then you better forget about getting FedEx or UPS rates, because they are FAR more productive than we are...

 

Carl,

I am disappointed too with what I am reading, but I fail to see as you say, any proof that this a watered down version or that ALPA was worried that telling us the truth was not appropriate. Do you know for a fact or just guessing. I am curious and I am angry as well, but does this mean we are being blatantly lied too?

Also, my issue is with any mention of any DCI carrier or crew member getting any consideration at DAL at all whether scope, hiring, pass benefits anything. JV and code share needs to be addressed in much stronger language. Alaska code share has decimated QOL of every pilot at DAL especially west coast crews. Absolute hard limit language on scope and no more scope concession period. Not the strength of the language I want but then again I was not at the table with my peers going through how to concoct an opener. SO I will have to wait and see. DPA is not even in the equation at all. They are not here now, maybe we will see but any comparison to what DPA would do is pure fantasy and frankly irritating.

 

Early word is the phones are burning up in LEC Rep Land.

Turns out people are/were seriously unimpressed, and now the word has gone out to push the message via the "alternate" route.

I'm voting for Carl to receive, rather than serve.

Nu

 

Why? Just curious.

I'm not sure my position on the topic. After all, we don't really represent "them," but they do fly a lot of Delta passengers.

From a union perspective, I had hoped we might require ALPA membership to fly Delta pax.