Purple Drank

With the AIPs we have seen from our outmatched negotiators, and ALPA national's complete ineffectiveness, at some point the risk of dumping alpa for then IPA or a purely in-house union approaches zero. Or at least becomes lower than keeping ALPA.

Obviously, that point will be reached at different times by different folks. But at some point, 50% +1 of us will reach it.

JamesBond

You got almost all of the talking points. Good job.

80ktsClamp

Blind support? Hi, I'm 80, you must be new around here.

Speaking of can't win a lawsuit, how's TC doing on that track record? Just because ALPA sucks doesn't mean I want it to replace it with anything that will likely suck even worse.

Flytolive

What? The chances of leaving ALPA decreases with underwhelming AIPs? IPA?

capncrunch

We argree that ALPA sucks and the DPA isn't the best answer. Where we disagree is that you think ALPA is our only option. Feeling battered yet?

JamesBond

Funny, but 80 was a big antagonist at one point in the not too distant past. He and I had many run ins. His tune has changed somewhat which is an indication of a couple of things. 1 is that maybe he sees merit in the whole picture, and 2 is that he has grown up a little by investigating the whole burrito and not just focusing on a couple of ridiculous third rail items. You on the other hand have dug your heels into the point that only George Patton with a .45 could get you off the bridge.

Oh, that's right. You have me on ignore.

gloopy

I think he said poor AIP's/TA's may reduce the chance of a cutesy little indy union, particularly one as (justifiably or not) toxic as DPA.

Of course there aren't very many other options out there, and even fewer that are even semi viable. The closest that I can think of is IBT, and I have been very underwhelmed by their airline division, particularly with pilots. That said, they appear to be getting better, and arguably the best when it comes to "labor risk on the table" for many reasons. Besides, isn't Dubinsky running the airline division? He legally and forcefully put a hostile management team in their place before at United, which was largely forgotten because of 9-11 which obviously wasn't his/their fault and they immediately gave those gains back etc. That same mentality likely still persists to some extent because their management just threw a ton of money at them with no "addressing of their concerns" to hold it hostage either. They did it either out of the goodness of their hearts, or because they wanted to keep the peace. Hmmmm.

In any case, I think we're all better off, especially for now, sticking with ALPA. But they need to get their act together. The C&C (concessions and COLAs) mentality needs to go.

Purple Drank

I was saying the risks associated with dumping ALPA and switching CBAs will continue to approach zero. The risks...not the likelihood.

gzsg

DPA

1% pay raise

And no concessions.

Or we can keep doing this.

The TA concessions will just be the beginning.

As staffing gets tight with massive retirements, we will be making concession after concession after concession. Its in the DALPA DNA.

We can't change it.

gopher3

I seem to recall 80 being a big supporter of Nestor too. You know, Mr. Scope Hawk. He also seemed to agree with Bucking Bar a lot too. I would imagine he has aligned himself with Mason too now. Trends are a funny thing.