That guy's rich. Must be a 747 captain, and I'll betcha he has both a washer AND a dryer on the front porch....

And of course you could always do this on a few special Saturdays each year with THAT rig..

He is not rich. He used his profit sharing check for a down payment. He is financing that thing for 33 years. His payments are $219 a month and he is absolutely ecstatic. He used USAA's services to secure the price and he financed with the dealership. His APR is 32%. (insert sarcasm and smiley face)

TEN

I've lived in Phoenix, San Antonio, Abu Dhabi, Columbus MS, Del Rio TX, and Sumter SC -- I know my heat and humidity. Of all those Phoenix was probably my favorite location and much of that was because it was dry. I can run in 90F 20% humidity and feel like a human, in 83F 80% humidity I just want to die.

Anyway, great points all. Definitely appreciate everybody's responses, but probably no closer to making a decision :/.

Don't let being a non-Mormon scare you away from SLC. Were a "non-traditional" family and non-Mormon and not only has it been a Zero issue, our neighbors are great and it's a great place to live. Clean, low crime and great schools. Kids are 8th, Senior and CC Freshman....again Zero issues and they've made lots of friends. Been here 13 mos and bought in North Ogden, which is 1/2 the price of Park City for twice the home and up out of the Inversion on the Winter. State income tax is 5%, sales tax is 6.7%, property taxes on my house, $2800/yr. 45 min drive to SLC., but more importantly 30 min to incredible Skiing & several lakes in the summer. I highly recommend Cristine Carver of Coldwell Banker in Ogden. Another 10 min East through the Canyon is Huntsville and Eden.

Mike, PMed you back today. Thanks for that. You're not gonna escape humidity in GA. So, north or south ATL doesn't really matter. It's gonna suck. We did 5 + years there through new hire, furlough and return. As a result, we're in SoCal now.

Secondly, your drive to work is important. PTC or Newnan are straight shots to the parking lot. That's huge for a new hire/probie. Both have a DAL support structure and lots of friends. If you're looking for schools, PTC rocks. It's base housing on steroids. Take a trip, look around, and buy a golf cart.

I asked this over on the Poolie thread but it didn't get much traction. Maybe it's more appropriate here....

Aircraft preference question:

ASSUMING I have a choice....717, 737NG, or 320 to ATL? I live just under 3 hours from ATL and my priorities are stability and home time vs dollars.

How long are guys sitting reserve on the NG & bus before holding a line, and will that time be increased on the NG by the 757 displacements? I like the idea of BHM overnights in the 717, but it's a pretty substantial pay bump to the other aircraft. I just don't want to sit reserve for a year to get it.

Is there a way to find the hire date of the junior line holder on each jet to figure out how long to expect to sit reserve?

Sorry for the duplication. I should have known better than to post in the poolie thread just before an aircraft drop.

The simplest answer is the lowest paying equipment will generally be the most junior all things being equal. What you can't factor in is where crew resources will place block hours. The 717 is going somewhat more senior then it's pay rate. Better cockpit and extra time off from training May account for that. If getting off reserve is the priority I would bid either the 717 or 88. When new hire seat locks start expiring on the 717 it may go more junior.

The simplest answer is the lowest paying equipment will generally be the most junior all things being equal. What you can't factor in is where crew resources will place block hours. The 717 is going somewhat more senior then it's pay rate. Better cockpit and extra time off from training May account for that. If getting off reserve is the priority I would bid either the 717 or 88. When new hire seat locks start expiring on the 717 it may go more junior.

Also a growing category helps (717) vs a shrinking one (ER). Big pay bump to the 73N so that makes it more sr.

Bottom line, it's hard to answer your question for reasons beyond our control. There have been stretches that went on for 5-6 years where guys were the plug on the 727 panel. Then there have been times guys were holding a line first month they could bid.

If you can tolerate living within an hour or so from your base your life and paycheck will be much better. When you cross off the non-commutable trips, you'll have to be pretty senior to hold that line.

Bamaguy,

An AE closed yesterday that really opened things up. Very very junior Pilots were awarded positions out West - the movement is upon us.

As guys have said above there have been years of absolute stagnation and also times of very rapid movement. Fortunately for you we are now entering the latter.

If the movement continues, and it should with new aircraft coming and retirements picking up - it really will not matter.

I say if you are mainly concerned with seniority in ATL you should bid the 88 or 717 - and you should be a line holder within a year. There is still a lot of "churn" from years of built up stagnation and also the 717 fleet is still growing and being initially staffed. Once all this settles down the 717 will probably a little more junior and the 320 & 73N will probably trend more senior.

Don't pay attention to guys who said they were on reserve for years - there was little or no hiring during those times so the bottom of the last was totally stagnant. If we keep hiring upwards of 600/year life will be good fro a all new hires.

Oh, caveat- one black swan :eek: could change everything overnight.

Scoop

Thank you guys for the input, I appreciate it.

What's the thought on the Dtw msp bases going forward? Stagnant, shrinking or growing? I wonder when the 747s go if dtw will get any replacement or will all future international go to sea JFK or atl. What are you guys hearing or seeing

Any new hires able to bid LAX on the 737 or the ER these days? If not how long would one estimate with the current hiring trend?

LAX 7ER was just awarded to a 2014 hire.

Thanks. Wow, sounds like that's what to shoot for if one wants to get to LAX fairly soon. Is the 737 relatively more senior than the 7ER?

What kind of trips does the 7ER mainly fly out of LAX? Transcon? Hawaii red eyes?

On a similar note, any chance somebody could look up when the SLC 7ER plug was hired?

Plug is a 2010
On the last AE the most junior pilot awarded was a
01 NWA merged with 07 Delta guys about 1600 senior to the plug company wide

Commuting in Detroit
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img673/5949/4qOde5.gif

Sorry for the newb question, but what is a plug?

The "plug" is the bottom guy in a category, or the whole seniority list.

Thanks....

For anyone LAX based, does the LAX domicile also cover satellite bases, i.e. - SNA and LAX like AA, basically how DAL supports LGA, EWR, and JFK?

Not an LAX dude, but I believe they cover LAX, SNA, SAN, LGB, and Orange County.

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure SAN is not part of the mix. I do think Burbank is included.

Denny

I flew with an LAX reserve to SAN from JFK, and he was saying they cover everything from SAN to LAX. Course, he is a pilot, so who knows how much complaining is real.

Ok, I had to look it up!:)

My copy of the contract hasn't been updated for a while but I don't think this part has changed. Take a look at Section 23.S.10. The co-terminal bases for sitting short call in LAX (based on reporting to LAX) are LAX, ONT, SNA, BUR, and LGB.

Denny

I'm sure I'm wrong. I usually am, at least according to the CIC House.

Reserves do not cover SAN.

Well, in that case, all of us are wrong!:)

Denny

So if your kids have all flown the nest and you don't care anything about schools, where's the place to live near ATL?

LA guys cover LAX, SNA and ONT. We don't cover SAN, don't fly out of LGB, and haven't had originating trips in BUR in several years.

All I was sayin' is that, contractually, there could be trips originating and ending out of LGB and BUR that are covered by the LAX crews. Not to sound harsh, but the fact that we don't currently do trips out of LGB or BUR is beside the point. SAN is not part of the mix. I think that's what the original question was asking. (What airports does the LAX base cover?)

For guys not familiar with the LAX base, short call response time is based on being able to get to LAX with in the allotted time frame. (Which is not defined but is generally accepted to be in the 2 hour range depending on circumstances such as traffic.)

Denny

Oh, I understand Denny. In fact, I'd kill to fly out of BUR. That's about a 20 minute drive for me. I've been out here since the 73 category opened up and I've never seen a BUR or LGB segment. That's all I was saying.

Where do you live now and how long to LAX?

Up the 101, in Ventura County. 45 miles to LAX. Can be 45 minutes (at 3 AM) or 2 hours (during rush hour). I have several apps on my phone that give me options but I religiously leave my house 2 hours prior to sign in. Sometimes a little earlier if its a rush hour report.

You can be across the street from lax and not make a short call during rush hour (ok, hyperbole).

But seriously Buzz, the 101/405 merge is the gateway to hell.

It is definitely the gateway to hell! Thankfully, I've been a line holder for years and can game it. I often take the PCH just to look at the ocean and enjoy the drive. Love living here, hate the drive!

And, when I have to sign in at SNA or ONT, I drive down the night before and crash in a hotel. Those drives are horrendous, especially for a 5 AM sign in.

For LAX guys: I am looking at a possible move to the Temecula/Murrieta area in the next year. It's about 85 miles to LAX and 60 to SNA. How feasible is short call from there? Obviously dependent on traffic...

Well, the guidance is generally accepted as 2 hours to LAX. 85 miles is definitely pushing it. I live north, about 45 miles, and that's about right I think. For me, it's an hour to sometimes 2+, and I don't sit reserve. Traffic in LA is unpredictable at best. You could probably pull it off based on the time if day, but I wouldn't challenge rush hour or Fridays. Fridays on the highways in LA are hell.

Plus, remember it's seasonal, but you have to cover SNA and ONT as well.

To put a slightly sharper point on it, the guidance is promptly/readily available. This is "generally" viewed to be two hours, but the definition is clearly unclear for places where you have to cover multiple airports, ie: LA and NYC. I know in NYC, they want you to be approximately two hours from one of the 3 airports. If the airport you choose to be within approx. two hours of is Newark, you could be 3-3.5 hours from JFK/LGA.

I don't know for certain the big picture in LA, but would expect it to be consistent.

My recommendation would be to call and talk to the chief of scheduling, have him on speakerphone, have two DAL employees listen without speaking and discuss your plans for where you want to settle. That way, you get the chief on record, have witnesses, diminish stress and know where you stand. I wouldn't do it in a sneaky way, let him know what's up, but the policy is unclear for both the company and the pilots' benefit.