Think twice about Endeavor.
 

Things are not always what they seem...

For example, consider the following copy from the Endeavor website:

>>Pilots hired at Endeavor under the EtD Commitment will, upon becoming and remaining eligible under the provisions of the Endeavor-to-Delta Pilot Hiring and Commitment Program document, be hired as Delta pilots. As an EtD Commitment pilot, you will not be required to re-interview with Delta as your selection and screening by Endeavor and demonstrated performance thereafter will serve as your ticket to Delta. <<

"and demonstrted performance thereafter..."

What does that mean? Be good little boys and girls (don't make waves and/or stand up for your rights), and we'll put a word in for you at Delta.

There is NO GUARANTEE that you will get a Delta job if you work for Endeavor. NONE. What Endeavor is, is a litmus test to see if you are submissive enough to suck up at Delta later on.

What if you end up in the sim with some jerk and he or she puts an unsat on your PRIA record because he or she had a bad day? Bye, bye Delta.

All Endeavor is, is one big checkride.

Beware.

good point

But the email i got from today told me to prepare for my FINAL airline interview. The Delta pilot selection process is ABSOLUTE....I will never have to go through it again. I am getting my app ready right now!

Hahahahaha! That quote was from the same email.

The bs never stops, eh?

Think twice? More like run away.... Compass, Mesa, and PSA are the best bets today if you are looking at regionals with upcoming movement/advancement and you'll get to Delta/American/United a lot sooner.

Think twice about Endeavor.
 

You can still stand up for your rights thru your union, have excellent attendance, and work ethic. Don't let your ability to succeed as an individual be overshadowed by groupthink. If I was starting out all over again I would consider this opportunity, but I would also work like hell to make it on my own and re-interview somewhere else possibly at Delta before the EtD ticket.

What world do you live in? Those risks are going to be there at any company. And with today's information technology, Delta or (insert company) can find out anything about you if they want to. Very few people are going to have a spotless record when it comes time to interview or transition to a major airline. The best thing is to own up to anything negative.

Not really true. Delta will know EVERYTHING about you. If you happen to get one of those little letters in your file that falls off in a year that (insert company) will not see, Delta will see! All I am saying is know the risks.

The "demonstrated performance" is the fine print that is explained as not failing a bunch of check rides (I think the max is 2), attendance issues, and being a CA (I think it's 2 years). In the end those would apply to anyone going anywhere. The EtD hasn't been a success by any means, but I don't think the restrictions are too far out of line. The bigger piece is getting things turned around for the folks here and having DL give some type of clear plan going forward. Until the folks here are in a better mindset, recruiting would gain many folks as current employees are the best recruiters...

Endeavor is just about the worst choice for any aspiring regional pilot. Go anywhere else.

What a load of BS....

You can't be a retard at any airline and expect to move onto a major.

True things suck here right now...but this place is not the worst place to go. If I was just starting out and Delta was my number one...I'd give this place a serious look. Especially if I lived with mom and dad! :)

This sums it up pretty damn well. The writing was on the wall for a while, Delta buying 9E was the kiss of death.

Now its not written on the wall, its actually written on A4 paper with DL's letter head on it.

wow...absolutely it is the worst place to go. Get your head out of the clouds and look around. If you're not in the top 5% then it's by far the worst place to go...right up there with Great Lakes. There is a reason everyone who can is getting out ASAP. It's a death trap.

No they won't if you're proactive about reviewing your file before you get to that step and get everything removed that can be removed.

What I don't understand is how are you supposed to get the two years as Captain if they are downgrading for the foreseeable future?

This will be your biggest hurdle, not whether you can stay in line or not.

I'm curious, has this EtD program had any affect on the amount of newhires?

As of September 5th update they have hired 3 pilots.

Got my EtD email invite today. I laughed and laughed, and then cried and cried.

This is true right now but any fee for departure airline is a lot closer to 9E's circumstances than you might think. Compass might be the place to be today, that might no be the case next month. There are no safe bets. Don't forget, this game is a marathon not a sprint.

How long have you been in this industry? You know how this industry works.

You stated the obvious here. How in the world would someone make a decision of where to go based on assumptions? A pilot has to make decisions based on what he knows today. There's no other way. Yes, Compass is great right now and so was Mesaba when I was hired there in 2007. I get it. But to look at 9E and say things are TERRIBLE there now but MIGHT get better 3 years from now is asinine. No way could a rational person look at these circumstances and decide to go to 9E based on what they think could happen. They look at the now and go with it.

Again, this is not a sprint, it is a marathon. I'm not drinking the Kool-Aid but if your end goal is Delta and you lived in NY, I don't see a reason to go anywhere but 9E. Of course you make decisions on what is known today, Delta has put it in writing to offer a job to any new hire. At a time when Delta has 10,000 resumes on file that is huge. In the end that offer is just as good as any contract Delta/American has signed with Compass securing the flying you are currently doing. If you want to fly for Delta and you are not a military pilot, there is really only one path, work for 9E. I expect Delta to double down on this program this next year making it even harder for non 9E pilots to get hired.

3 years ago pinnacle had an industry leading contract, airplanes still arriving, hiring ongoing, and upgrade times dropping. My my how things change. 5 years ago nobody would have even thought about a 3-way regional merger. This industry is completely unpredictable.

Many accredited university aviation programs have bridge agreements with various regional airlines. As we've seen, these programs which place an emphasis on "preferred hiring" are by no means sufficient to provide for a reliable staffing model at the regional level.

I dabbled in sales for a few years, and one important thing I learned was that a lead and a sale are two entirely different things. While Delta may have 10,000 resumes on file, that doesn't equate to 10,000 new hires ready for class next week. Many regionals have come to understand this problem from an intimate perspective in the recent past.

While a company may have a preference for your education or experience, in general the emphasis is on qualifications and aptitude. Given the projected retirements and growth industry-wide, I don't imagine the emphasis will be fundamentally different in the future.

I honestly don't think the managers realize the 10,000 resumes on their desk are also the same resumes on desks at United, American, Delta etc.

Yes, they will! I know more then one person who went to the SSP and the interviewer knew things about that person that was never put on the application or was in his file. Delta knows everything. Thats just the fact.

I guess I don't understand how you can describe this as a marathon when you can't possibly imagine or know what will be coming down the shoot even a month from now. How is that a marathon? It's a sprint to the best regional at the time. Right now, sprint to Compass...sprint away form 9E. You can't marathon a regional airline. Impossible. Your assumption about 9E being about the only way to Delta in a year or so is far fetched and a little comical. The ETD is a slap in the face and a disgrace. No respectable regional pilot can say one good thing about that. It's all smoke a mirrors. Delta is cunning and ruthless. Don't get caught up in these lame programs that won't work. They serve a purpose for now...that is to get more guys in the door to fly the crappy 200s on reserve in NYC until they're all gone.

The main issue with the EtD is that as a new hire with a Delta CJO, you don't have the protection of the mainline union. Your future Delta job is basically at the mercy of management while you reside at 9E. Every pilot here knew the EtD would not work out the way that management wanted, in fact I think it turned away more pilots than the old hiring process. They didn't listen to us, now here we are.

Judging by the number of "my regional is better than your regional" or "I make $1 more per hour than you you loser" posts on APC, I really don't think it is that obvious to the average poster on here….either those that haven't been in the industry long enough for their regional to be one of those "bottom feeders" (it goes in cycles as you know) or those that choose to forget it because thumping their chest makes them feel better.

Hopefully delta will wake up and give us a flow along with the 30 other 900's. Then this place will be the next compass.

I've already said exactly that in my first reply. My point was that we are able to get some things removed from our file.

Why do you want a flow? Name the airlines that had or have a flow that actually worked out...

Because every eligible SSP pilot has to get their chance before any EtD will see Delta. And because an EtD needs 2 years as CA before that chance. Look at the number of 9E CAs left and the amount of SSPs allowed per year going forward. Then account for the remaining 9E FOs who will upgrade. Then account for EtDs who will eventually see a left seat, and then on top of that, serve 2 years as CA. These EtDs will not see Delta. Not based on the current fleet plan. So arguably, the slowest way to get to Delta is through the EtD. A pilot is far better off going to Compass, Mesa, or PSA. Maybe even Piedmont now that their new contract passed and they stand to gain growth for the new AA.

How many pilots has Delta hired this year from 9E? And how many pilots from Mesa? Or PSA? Or Skywest? Or how many pilots from Virgin have gone to Delta Shy? The numbers don't lie.

True. But you are talking about 1,500 SSP potentials that have to have their chance before EtD can see a Delta Air Lines seat. The SSPs per year is capped. So that will take several years. Then the fleet has to expand for any EtD to ever seen an upgrade. There is no shortage of current FOs waiting to upgrade so the EtDs have a loong way to go. The only effective way would have been for Delta to give a Delta seniority number at the time of passing the Delta/Endeavor interview and being assigned an Endeavor class date. Anything short of that is just wishful thinking signed on a piece of paper that Delta can change on whim.

The good news is, barring ISIS/oil/etc crisis, the hiring should really be picking up at every single LCC/legacy: Virgin, JetBlue, Spirit, Frontier, Allegiant, Delta, American, and United should all be hiring in good numbers for 2015.

You're lost and don't even work here. If I wanted delta this is where I would come, and if they ever wake up and give flow everyone will want to come here. maybe even you again.

pot, meet kettle.

your lost?

y'all lost?