Numbers of flow
 

Look like envoy renege on the flow agreement. Only 10 in June, now 10 in July. They suppose to send 25 each month. Look like bad news on the flow.

Really? I heard 26 in July.

26 for pool only. 10 flowing only.

No, I heard 21 flows in the first Jul class and 5 in the second class. I was honestly expecting more along the lines of 10 bodies in class, but these are the numbers that I've gotten.

They are only required to send 35% right now right? I think they are sending more than expected right now. 25 minimum triggers with the 40th E175

How many did AA hire?

Got this from the AA thread.

18 lax airbus international
17 lga 737 domestic
6 phl 190 international

So 41 for the July 11th class apparently.

Negative...25 is the min, but if the monthly hire number is large enough, it's 35% until the 40th 175 arrives, then it jumps to 50%.

I'll stick by my statement of 26, not 10 flows going to class at AA for JUL. Typical Rondon. Always has some story about how the company is going to violate the flow just to get a rise out of people.

Maybe I am missing a letter in the contract and/or the Envoy profile on THIS site is inaccurate. I recall ZB, during a conference call, discussing that we would have smaller flow through classes due to only taking 35% for the 2-3 months between "824" and delivery of the 40th 175. What page of the contract are you reading that says 25?

Regardless, there are apparently 19 going next week and a handful in the second class, which would be about 25 and more than the 35% contractual requirement. This is great news as Most we were only expecting about 15 a month through the summer

This is incorrect. There is no 25 min before the 40th. Regardless, it doesn't look like it should be an issue.

Check Letter 12-04.3.d

I hope everyone, new guys especially, see this as evidence that rondonq1 is a troll whose only intent is to spread misinformation and attempt to cast envoy in the worst light possible, regardless of truth or not.

Why does a 60 year old man spend so much time trashing a company that he doesn't work for anymore, who paid his bills for over 20 years? One can only imagine. I am sure the answer who keep psychologists busy for years. Regardless of the reason though, please take a moment to consider how blatantly incorrect that he is, attempting to pass false information as fact so you can appreciate how you should never give any consideration to anything he says. His sole goal is slander and defamation. It is for this reason, his previous handles were banned which will not doubt, ultimately be the fate of his newest identity, rondonq1.

I'm pretty sure that isn't the same rondonq. Kind of like the other closely named people like dacuj or mason69. Just an easy way to disparage a guy that is probably retired fishing on a lake right now.

Yes, rondonq1 is not the original rondonq, he is eaglefly.

Not his style at all. Eaglefly may be argumentative, but he's really never been a troll. His posts are always very wordy and he usually knows his facts as they pertain to AA. This person's posts are troll bait, short, and usually completely wrong, in terms of actual facts.

This guy strikes me as that guy who got fired, then ended up at Alegiant. These posts are his style.

Not his style at all. Eaglefly may be argumentative, but he's really never been a troll. His posts are always very wordy and he usually knows his facts as they pertain to AA. This person's posts are troll bait, short, and usually completely wrong, in terms of actual facts.

This guy strikes me as that guy who got fired, then ended up at Alegiant - ag386. These posts are his style.

Agreed...not Eaglefly. This other joker is just a pure troll that spreads 100% false information in an attempt to spread doom and gloom. And like you said, Eaglefly is a pessimist in regards to both AA's future and Envoy's, but he is always factual and doesn't make up fake news to get people riled up. Notice he went NORDO pretty quick in this thread.

How many pilots is Envoy losing per month total. Including flow and other attrition.

A little bit less than we're hiring.

Ok. Because I noticed per APC that the pilot group had grown by 200 pilots.

Per the latest union blast mail, we're +88 YTD. Sitting at 1,980ish Pilots.

Wow, I'm very surprised to hear it's that low, considering how many they've been hiring.

It's a healthy movement, lots from top and lots from bottom with growth.

400 NH YTD
260 attrition (of the 260 189 flow/ 71 did not leave for flow)
88 net increase in pilots.

This is the information give to us by the union within this week. Obviously these numbers don't jive.

That makes much more sense than the 200 new pilots apc is showing. I couldn't imagine you had hired enough to cover attrition plus 200. Thanks for the info.

Some of our growth is just to keep the perpetual training bubble inflated.

What is the most junior date of hire to flow recently. Just curious

From the 7/25 class

9/27/04 according to the MEC Newsblast.

Man that's depressing.

Why? Do you think the guys that are flowing planned to be here that long? Most have their apps out trying to get on with other airlines and have been unable to. AA went years during this era with out hiring and furloughed thousands of pilots.

They started working at Eagle/Envoy with no flow except the 824. (I'm pretty sure the protected pilots didn't have flow until Oct 2011.) I know I didn't come to Envoy for the flow because there was none.

Isn't psa flowing 2008 hires right now? Did they have a flow when they were hired?

Yes and No.

Man that's depressing

I'm pretty sure you are the only one who is jealous of PSA flow.

FWIW...I just finished a 4 day with a former Eagle Flow guy. He was 16 years at Eagle and said that the 824 and all the others have been offered flow. As a former US guy I don't know the ins and outs of the Eagle agreements and arbitration but according to my probationary guy, those agreements and remedies have all now been complied with. According to him the flow is running much faster than anyone anticipated.

It's running at the contractual minimum. "Faster than anyone expected" is really overstating things in the current environment. That being said, if you had asked me 5 years ago if we would be flowing 30/month in 2017 (25/month for PP), I would have recommended you for a mental evaluation.

Almost as depressing as the rumors over on the AA threads saying that hiring over there will stop for the year after September because of training backlogs.

6 months ago if you would have said we would be upgrading at 3 months I would have called you crazy. Things are changing fast and trying to predict anything in this environment is asinine.

Highly highly doubtful. With that said, I sent an email to recruitment asking them directly.