Well that’s not my fight. Regional guys have been trying to get pay raises on the table forever. Meh pay scale is what it is. I’ve never had those delusions

I’ve valued all the input I’ve received here and elsewhere. Envoy has good people working there for the most part. I think more than anything that’s what I would value is a good crew.

I just wish I was coming in at a time when the house was in a little better order. Swing gear for 6-12 months and upgrade in order of proper seniority.

I’m not one of those that’s above throwing gear for a 28 year old captain.

Sad thing is I think I’d fit in with the pilot group at Envoy pretty well. The bases are good, so is the equipment.

But I’m not willing to sit reserve for most of my career there. Which is what I’m being asked to do.

Just to be clear my decision is made, Ive discussed it with my family and other pilots and the deal isn’t attractive. But I can still contribute to the conversation I think.

Bad timing. Just too bad.

They’re going to have to throw more then just a 45k bonus and death sentence to LGA to attract any street captains. Especially now that instant upgrades are becoming the norm everywhere like Endeavor and Skywest.

You’re right.

Why go to instant captain seat and be perpetually hundreds of numbers junior when you can go somewhere else and sit right seat and upgrade into a halfway reasonable quality of life?

Don’t even have to sit right seat. Endeavor you can go straight to captain in Atlanta with way better reserve rules and making 80+ an hour plus a 10k bonus.

Skywest lets you take your pay seniority with you. So say someone has been at a different regional for 3 years and has 1,000 121 time you can go there and start at third year captain pay right away.

Envoy has to fix their reserve system and or increase their hourly rates. To attract anyone eligible to be a street captain.

So you live in DFW. I don't see why you wouldn't go anywhere but Envoy.

I think/heard from a friend RW recently said at a CA upgrade dinner we need 400 HVA over two years. All you need is about 50 below you to hold a line in LGA. How long will that take? Who knows. It all depends on how many HVAs join you at Envoy after you. If they hit that number then your QOL will not be as bad as you are expecting. Once you get back to DFW then your QOL will sky rocket. The main question is "How long will you suffer before it gets bearable?" No one can give you an accurate answer. I personally think you would be back to DFW in 12-18 months. But I could be completely wrong.

All I can tell you is that commuting to reserve for Envoy is the absolute worst. Reserve living in base is the absolute best. (Or at least it is right now.) It doesn't matter if you are junior or senior it still sucks.

When reading the horror stories and the positive stories, know that they are both likely true, but likely infrequent or short lived.

Here lies the problem. They want 400 HVAs over two years. No where do they indicate wanting to improve QOL for the pilot group or acknowledge the horrible QOL HVAs will endure if they have to commute to NY. HVA's only saving grace is getting more HVA's in below them and I think we're still too early to tell whether or not the program will work.

Absolutely agree!!

I honestly believe that all they have to do is raise the CA rates to match Endeavor’s, and they’d have the CA problem fixed. There would be no shortage of HVA’s waiting in line and many of the the senior FO’s bidding reserve (to avoid hitting 1000) would finish their time and upgrade.

wait...

they want 16 HVAs coming aboard per month for the next 24 months?

what are the FOs on property doing??? Envoy cant have that many FOs that are that far out to 1000 hours.

Surely there are at least a few hundred that are within weeks if not a month or two of hitting the time?

EDIT:

assuming you get all 400, thats $18,000,000 in bonuses paid out

offer your high time FOs the $45,000 bonus, pay them 150% for each hour needed to hit 1,000 hours, force their upgrade and base change, once they are there pay them at 200-300% per hour for the next 12 months in the base they didint want and return them to normal payscale when they bid base change or hit 12 months whichever comes first

They shot the wad with the last bid. There’s surely a handful of FO’s close and eager for that 4th stripe, but most are doing everything in their power to avoid hitting 1000.