Seems to me there are 100 pilots or so that are going to get screwed by their own bonus. The company wouldn’t let them finish IOE so they don’t have to pay the bonus. Now they are in the line of fire to get furloughed because they haven’t finished training.

The union can’t negotiate furlough protection in exchange for forgoing the bonus because the bonus is outside the CBA. On the other hand, individual pilots can’t negotiate that with the company either because furloughs ARE governed by the CBA. It’s a lousy situation.

Correct, they paid for ATP/CTP before. No clue what will happen when hiring starts again. With a lot of ATP qualified pilots out on the street I wouldn’t be surprised if that was no longer included but at this point it’s all speculation.

Agreed except they aren’t in the line of fire because they haven’t finished training, they’re in the line of fire because they’re junior enough to be as are some that have finished training but have still gotten WARNs. 100% agree that it’s a lousy situation though and I believe I saw someone asking about something similar in one of the FB groups recently. I can’t imagine the stress attached with all of this especially with questions about what the union can and can not do for you.

There’s a big misnomer about what the union can and can’t do for a probationary pilot.

The union can do everything but goto arbitration for a probationary pilot. That’s it. They have every other effort and union representation as any other pilot on the list.

Believe it or not, more time is spent by the union representing probationary pilots than non probationary pilots.

Covering ATP-CTP probably will remain included everywhere, but it'll take a long time before anyone hits that point in the applicant pool.

Maybe so, maybe not. Before the reg changed, plenty of pilots got their ATP. When it
changed, very few did. When hiring begins again, it may be a discriminator. If a company has a choice between two pilots who have their hours but one has their ATP, or maybe just the CTP course, who are they going to hire first? It is, unfortunately for those wanting to get hired, no longer a pilot’s market.

Interesting to find out what will happen with the cadet program, I mean it’s going to be quite a while before they need min time pilots again.

No. Mesa is no longer offering ATP-CTP coverage. Those being interviewed for the pool must have an ATP. Mesa also requiring IFR and landing currency. I have no idea why.

I rushed to get my ATP back when they announced the rule change because I believed pilots would still be on the hook to pay for it - except instead of $3k in a light twin it was now $20k at some training center. It became a pilots market though hence airlines paying for it. After all this that’s not gonna happen though.

Remember, people used to pay for their own types during the lost decade. Now during this next one they’ll be paying for their own ATPs as well.

I think what is likely to happen is the cost of the ATP-CTP and the written, which is down to about $5K, will be back on the pilot. The ride can still be done with the type in initial training with the airline. There was a time when that’s what you needed, the ATP written. It’s just that now to take the written, you have to have the CTP completed. Also before the “CTP mills” fired up it was $20K, not $5K.

You go back far enough, before the 1500 hour rule, there were outfits that you actually paid to fly with to build your time. Mostly multi.

It’s all a function of supply and demand. Currently there is little to no demand, when the demand does pick up, there will be a large supply of pilots.