CNN
05-19-2021, 11:17 AM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2019
Posts: 531
standards for airmanship, professionalism, and safety should be "extra" high at the wholly owned carriers, since there isn't really any future screening process before moving to bigger metal with 100s of passengers.
The possibility of getting fired for poor piloting incentivizes staying sharp. "The union will protect me" and "I never have to interview again" lets people get lazy if they want.
I'm sure it's not that simple, but does "flow" allow pilots to get complacent ?
The possibility of getting fired for poor piloting incentivizes staying sharp. "The union will protect me" and "I never have to interview again" lets people get lazy if they want.
I'm sure it's not that simple, but does "flow" allow pilots to get complacent ?
05-19-2021, 12:28 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,727
I've flown with a lot of flows over the years, and Envoy is just like the rest - almost all great to fly with and just a few weirdos. Same with the off the street hires - Republic, LCC, military, etc...
The media would have a field day if they were to sit in on one of our human factors classes. I'm sure the same is true for Delta, United, etc.
The media would have a field day if they were to sit in on one of our human factors classes. I'm sure the same is true for Delta, United, etc.
05-19-2021, 12:41 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Posts: 123
I don't fly for ENY, but I do fly for a WO. All regionals have their challenges. ENY isn't the only one to make mistakes -- remember when CommuteAir missed the runway in Presque Isle?
The fact of the matter is that regional pilots fly longer days with more legs, into less controlled environments, often times under greater stress for statistical performance, on airframes with significantly older technology than mainline. A great example is the lack of in-flight weather. Mainline can access onboard wi-fi to access global weather products. All WO's are stuck using radar that couldn't heat up a bean burrito. Expand on that to the fact that, of the wholly owned' s, AA's largest singlet type is the 145 which isn't even equipped with a wifi product for the pilots to tap into.
Then we can discuss the consistently negative behavior of CP's at WO's. All of them are in it for the resume, because they got lazy flying the line, or because they're just not good pilots. Some of my CP's have been wrong, on the record, regarding airframe limitations, FOM procedures, MEL's, and HR and Corporate policies. But they sure will be quick to point out a lanyard that's not compliant, or socks that aren't black, or pants that aren't from an "approved" vendor.
So of course those poor guys were going to land in ORD. The risk of having to deal with Air Ops at a regional isn't the same as the risk at a mainline. There's no care, concern, or genuine leadership at almost any of the FFD carriers these days. Add to that their limited weather product availability, the fact that they probably didn't have gas to make them comfortable diverting (if I remember, I think the field was VMC at the time and at my company you'd have to go to court to get some extra gas on a VMC day).
TL;DR: All regionals have some safety issues. Almost all of them start and end at nonexistent leadership, poor culture, and a race to be "the best in the system, but only so far as on-time performance, because nobody cares about having the best place for our pilots." In some ways, this is no different than issues mainline carriers face. ENY pilots are just fine, and I've had the pleasure of jump seating on them a time or two. We might play like Navy vs. Army, but CNN's just looking to dog an airline now that people are flying again. This isn't a big issue. It would be a bigger issue if they had actually put the plane on that runway.
The fact of the matter is that regional pilots fly longer days with more legs, into less controlled environments, often times under greater stress for statistical performance, on airframes with significantly older technology than mainline. A great example is the lack of in-flight weather. Mainline can access onboard wi-fi to access global weather products. All WO's are stuck using radar that couldn't heat up a bean burrito. Expand on that to the fact that, of the wholly owned' s, AA's largest singlet type is the 145 which isn't even equipped with a wifi product for the pilots to tap into.
Then we can discuss the consistently negative behavior of CP's at WO's. All of them are in it for the resume, because they got lazy flying the line, or because they're just not good pilots. Some of my CP's have been wrong, on the record, regarding airframe limitations, FOM procedures, MEL's, and HR and Corporate policies. But they sure will be quick to point out a lanyard that's not compliant, or socks that aren't black, or pants that aren't from an "approved" vendor.
So of course those poor guys were going to land in ORD. The risk of having to deal with Air Ops at a regional isn't the same as the risk at a mainline. There's no care, concern, or genuine leadership at almost any of the FFD carriers these days. Add to that their limited weather product availability, the fact that they probably didn't have gas to make them comfortable diverting (if I remember, I think the field was VMC at the time and at my company you'd have to go to court to get some extra gas on a VMC day).
TL;DR: All regionals have some safety issues. Almost all of them start and end at nonexistent leadership, poor culture, and a race to be "the best in the system, but only so far as on-time performance, because nobody cares about having the best place for our pilots." In some ways, this is no different than issues mainline carriers face. ENY pilots are just fine, and I've had the pleasure of jump seating on them a time or two. We might play like Navy vs. Army, but CNN's just looking to dog an airline now that people are flying again. This isn't a big issue. It would be a bigger issue if they had actually put the plane on that runway.
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