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-   -   Its time to negotiate a better flow (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/envoy-airlines/135482-its-time-negotiate-better-flow.html)

KirillTheThrill 10-28-2021 08:22 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3315473)
Hard to see how the regional model can compete. Even ACMIs pay so well these days. 1st year Atlas FOs making 205/hr, and senior CAs making 520/hr for some flights, without doing OT.

That 50/hr for the dream of flowing one day just isn't going to cut it.

Hey Dera, we finally agree on something 😀.

dera 10-28-2021 08:26 PM


Originally Posted by KirillTheThrill (Post 3315479)
Hey Dera, we finally agree on something 😀.

You agree with my math now, 205/hr is 4x regional FO hourly pay? :)

KirillTheThrill 10-28-2021 08:36 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3315481)
You agree with my math now, 205/hr is 4x regional FO hourly pay? :)

Nah not that part, but don’t worry I don’t count GoJet paying their pilots 300% either. Technically they’re the highest paid regional pilots in the industry right now 😃.

dera 10-28-2021 08:39 PM


Originally Posted by KirillTheThrill (Post 3315485)
Nah not that part, but don’t worry I don’t count GoJet paying their pilots 300% either. Technically they’re the highest paid regional pilots in the industry right now 😃.

That's OT pay though. The 205/hr is not. Plenty of 175% flying here as part of your awarded line.

pitchattitude 10-28-2021 08:58 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3315473)
Hard to see how the regional model can compete. Even ACMIs pay so well these days. 1st year Atlas FOs making 205/hr, and senior CAs making 520/hr for some flights, without doing OT.

That 50/hr for the dream of flowing one day just isn't going to cut it.

The WOs aren’t the only ones paying $50ish/hr. Mesa to Skywest and everything in between aren’t paying that much different. SKW is planning on growing to 7K pilots by end of next year. No flow with anyone else. I foresee changes. There will have to be, but the demise of regionals is not around the corner. There is just too much incentive to keep two separate classes of pilots. Still have fractionals and part 135 stuff. Wages and conditions will have to change and more people will start deciding to be pilots again.

FAIPMAFIA 11-01-2021 03:41 PM

We must demand better. The union isn’t doing anything unfortunately. It’s actually in crumbles. Everyone keeps living.

dera 11-01-2021 04:13 PM


Originally Posted by FAIPMAFIA (Post 3317198)
We must demand better. The union isn’t doing anything unfortunately. It’s actually in crumbles. Everyone keeps living.

Demand, how?
How, what and from who, would you demand?

Allegheny 11-01-2021 04:44 PM


Originally Posted by Excargodog (Post 3314412)
The problem is that the AAG business model REQUIRES regional feed and they DON’T (at least not yet) need flow. They can (at least at present) meet their mainline new hire needs by hiring ex military, hiring away competitors regional pilots, and hiring ULCC people who are still junior enough to be tempted. But increasing the rate of acquisition of their own regional pilots would just hurt their bottom line. They’d much rather hurt their competitors bottom lines by stealing their pilots than make it harder to keep their own regionals fully staffed.

And I really think if F9 and NK do something about their ludicrous first year pay, a lot of regionals are going to lose a lot of reasonably senior people.


https://i.ibb.co/FX535cJ/12438-F39-5...5-A2-E7579.jpg

This will be interesting to watch play out.


What he said!!

FAIPMAFIA 11-01-2021 07:40 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3317213)
Demand, how?
How, what and from who, would you demand?

Dera! I know you in person. You know exactly what I’m talking about!

TORO

Cleatus99 11-01-2021 08:18 PM

Would you like to work for a stable, secure..
 
Maybe trying to fix compensation?

Compensation Analyst in Irving, Texas | Careers at Envoy Headquarters (icims.com)


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