More block hours and 145s
01-09-2020 | 02:03 PM
#21
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 288
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More block hours and 145s
Comparing Jan numbers to Feb numbers for captains:
Total lines increased by 23. Total bidding captains increased by 12.
Total hard lines in Jan were 288 for 503 captains (57.25% hard lines).
Total hard lines in Feb are 311 for 515 captains (60.38%).
EWR gained 3 lines. CLE gained 2 lines. IAH gained 11 lines. TYS is static at 8.
ORD 145 lost 3 lines, but the 175 picked up 6 lines for a net gain of 3.
IAH 175 gained 4 lines.
Now this means very little when we have no clue how many relief lines there will be for each base. This is one thing that I've advocated for over and over again, and that's transparency. If you're a hard line holder, relief line holder, or reserve, you should be able to see bids for all bases when ALL the bidding is done. This would allow for a better idea for what the company is actually doing and trending toward.
As far as most junior awards go for captains, this is for each base:
CLE: 7/2005
EWR: 3/2007
IAH: 10/2005
ORD: 11/2004
IAH 175: 8/1999
ORD 175: 8/2006
For first officers, the most junior hard line is as follows:
CLE: 5/2019
EWR: 5/2019
IAH: 5/2019
ORD: 6/2019
IAH 175: 7/2019
ORD 175: 7/2019
There is a total of 378 total FOs. There will always be more CAs for line check duties and other stuff. There is a total of 893 active pilots bidding for Feb 2020. I know of quite a few on medical leave though, so we can easily say there is at least 900 active pilots.
The seniority list shows 1,426 (as of 1/9) pilots. Out of that total, there is 1,259 active (which doesn't include those on medical/military). So that means we have approximately 360 pilots in training and not bidding yet. Lets say there is a ratio of 55/45 for CA:FO. That means we should have approx 693 CAs and 567 FOs.
I'm not sure how many of the FOs bidding have been awarded CA spots but haven't begun training, but I will say that with the numbers and if hiring continues, one can expect to have a very short sit on reserve, expect to fly a lot, and may upgrade as soon as they get their 1000 SIC part 121 time.
Total lines increased by 23. Total bidding captains increased by 12.
Total hard lines in Jan were 288 for 503 captains (57.25% hard lines).
Total hard lines in Feb are 311 for 515 captains (60.38%).
EWR gained 3 lines. CLE gained 2 lines. IAH gained 11 lines. TYS is static at 8.
ORD 145 lost 3 lines, but the 175 picked up 6 lines for a net gain of 3.
IAH 175 gained 4 lines.
Now this means very little when we have no clue how many relief lines there will be for each base. This is one thing that I've advocated for over and over again, and that's transparency. If you're a hard line holder, relief line holder, or reserve, you should be able to see bids for all bases when ALL the bidding is done. This would allow for a better idea for what the company is actually doing and trending toward.
As far as most junior awards go for captains, this is for each base:
CLE: 7/2005
EWR: 3/2007
IAH: 10/2005
ORD: 11/2004
IAH 175: 8/1999
ORD 175: 8/2006
For first officers, the most junior hard line is as follows:
CLE: 5/2019
EWR: 5/2019
IAH: 5/2019
ORD: 6/2019
IAH 175: 7/2019
ORD 175: 7/2019
There is a total of 378 total FOs. There will always be more CAs for line check duties and other stuff. There is a total of 893 active pilots bidding for Feb 2020. I know of quite a few on medical leave though, so we can easily say there is at least 900 active pilots.
The seniority list shows 1,426 (as of 1/9) pilots. Out of that total, there is 1,259 active (which doesn't include those on medical/military). So that means we have approximately 360 pilots in training and not bidding yet. Lets say there is a ratio of 55/45 for CA:FO. That means we should have approx 693 CAs and 567 FOs.
I'm not sure how many of the FOs bidding have been awarded CA spots but haven't begun training, but I will say that with the numbers and if hiring continues, one can expect to have a very short sit on reserve, expect to fly a lot, and may upgrade as soon as they get their 1000 SIC part 121 time.
The ORD 175 CA is inaccurate. There are multiple 2014 hires, I flew with one a few weeks ago. Unless you just meant line holders?
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01-09-2020 | 02:59 PM
#22
Remember the Cant...
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 132
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From: E145
More block hours and 145s
Yes that list is for junior line holders.
Was that text from the IAH line builder report/summary? Because I don’t see one for ORD. ALPA should just publish one summary for all bases. This information is critical in making informed QOL decisions (like a system bid).
01-09-2020 | 05:35 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 629
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From: Reclined seat
These are just phase 1 hard line's I'm talking about. Relief lines can vary significantly, and are not used as a good indication of where one will be.
01-09-2020 | 07:34 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 744
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More block hours and 145s
I would get a line in February if I didn’t have mil leave. So a few months on reserve for IAH 175 isn’t terrible. Definitely quicker than I thought. Now the question will be if I’m back on reserve after the fall slow down later this year.
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This is where I start making people angry. I apologize ahead of time.
Did you notice how many ULAs are in the bid packet with higher seniority than you? Also have you considered how many ORD FOs are itching to come back to IAH once they can hold a line? How many ORD FOs are senior to you? I bet at least 1/3 of them will be putting in for IAH when they think they can hold a line. I know I will be.
And then there’s this:
“E175 departure growth will be in ORD from a domicile standpoint and we will continue to see our departures from IAH fall to around 10 per day. For E175 IAH flying we will still have a maintenance footprint but the ability to swap out crews in the middle of the day diminishes with the summer schedule. E175 IAH crews will start in IAH but may not return until three or four days later when the aircraft returns for maintenance.”
Again, my apologies.
01-10-2020 | 03:09 AM
#26
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 288
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Since I was in the first group to be awarded ORD initially, I’m not sure I see your point. Are you saying a bunch of guys local to IAH swapped to ORD in January just to be off of reserve? What makes sense to me is that they were guys who wanted 175 initially and then moved to ORD when they could because it was an easier commute. As for ULAs, I can’t control how many people there are and now I’m one of them. All I know is my seniority moves up about 5 spots per week, and I’m hoping at least some of that is 175 guys moving on. There’s also a good chance I won’t even be back to XJT after my leave, and that’s good for those guys junior to me.
The pairings at IAH are exactly as described in Scott’s email right now. We leave on day 1, and do all of our flying in and out of ORD and then come back on the last day. Who cares.
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The pairings at IAH are exactly as described in Scott’s email right now. We leave on day 1, and do all of our flying in and out of ORD and then come back on the last day. Who cares.
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01-10-2020 | 04:34 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2019
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Since I was in the first group to be awarded ORD initially, I’m not sure I see your point. Are you saying a bunch of guys local to IAH swapped to ORD in January just to be off of reserve? What makes sense to me is that they were guys who wanted 175 initially and then moved to ORD when they could because it was an easier commute. As for ULAs, I can’t control how many people there are and now I’m one of them. All I know is my seniority moves up about 5 spots per week, and I’m hoping at least some of that is 175 guys moving on. There’s also a good chance I won’t even be back to XJT after my leave, and that’s good for those guys junior to me.
The pairings at IAH are exactly as described in Scott’s email right now. We leave on day 1, and do all of our flying in and out of ORD and then come back on the last day. Who cares.
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The pairings at IAH are exactly as described in Scott’s email right now. We leave on day 1, and do all of our flying in and out of ORD and then come back on the last day. Who cares.
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First of all, the way I read your previous post was that you are on reserve for January. If you have had a line for months then I misunderstood and this is not accurate.
Assuming you are on reserve I’m saying there are:
1- a lot of senior folks who bid the 175 and started class after you and are IAH based. They are not done with training yet.
2- a lot of people who are senior to you who also got ORD initially but wanted IAH. When they are able to hold a line in IAH they will put in for a base trade. Then every time there is an opening they will move into the base ahead of you, as opposed to new hires coming in below you.
As for Scott’s email, he used the words “departures will fall to around 10 per day.” You say that’s already the case, ok. I guess I’m thinking the number of lines in IAH could actually decrease as more flying transitions to Chicago. Maybe not.
To boil it all down, if you are on reserve in January on the 175 in IAH, you will be there for a very long time. You could possibly get a line then go back on reserve as people senior to you come in to claim that line. And now that there are no new airplanes coming hiring is about to transition to the 145. The bottom line is if you are at the bottom of the list on the 175 in IAH you aren’t going anywhere for a very long time.
01-10-2020 | 04:49 AM
#28
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 288
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More block hours and 145s
2- a lot of people who are senior to you who also got ORD initially but wanted IAH. When they are able to hold a line in IAH they will put in for a base trade. Then every time there is an opening they will move into the base ahead of you, as opposed to new hires coming in.
I think I get what you’re saying. Are you assuming that everyone who is ULA is still in 175 training? There are guys in my guard unit who have bid the 175 and are out on long term mil leave. They have no intention of coming back to XJT any time soon. Not every ULA is someone in training.
But yes, being the second from the bottom line holder won’t mean much if just a few guys senior finish training and go back to IAH.
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01-10-2020 | 06:05 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2019
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More block hours and 145s
I think I get what you’re saying. Are you assuming that everyone who is ULA is still in 175 training? There are guys in my guard unit who have bid the 175 and are out on long term mil leave. They have no intention of coming back to XJT any time soon. Not every ULA is someone in training.
But yes, being the second from the bottom line holder won’t mean much if just a few guys senior finish training and go back to IAH.
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But yes, being the second from the bottom line holder won’t mean much if just a few guys senior finish training and go back to IAH.
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Ahhh ok I didn’t realize that’s where the folks with unpaid leave go. I get that. Maybe I should bid IAH sooner! I thought all those folks were still in training. I’m sure some of them probably are but not as many as I originally thought.
And what I was getting at is anyone in ORD can move to IAH the same way you did and many want to but not until they are sure they will hold a line.
01-10-2020 | 07:49 AM
#30
Line Holder
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 537
Likes: 42
The email itself felt contradictory in nature. Big UA wants more shells to fly, we tell them we can't due to staffing...Nothing is done to increase hiring levels. It states 60+ this month but out of those that don't make it or no-show is a repeat of early last year.
Yet, this right here is a sign for NH's to fight to be placed on the 145. Resist the urge to say no to wing mounted engines and new livery.
Yet, this right here is a sign for NH's to fight to be placed on the 145. Resist the urge to say no to wing mounted engines and new livery.
