New Video-Every $ Earned & Yr Worked Matters?
12-23-2017, 11:05 AM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 936
Originally Posted by HIFLYR
Wow, you want to shaft all the guys who will retire under this contract, so YOU will get more? Who's the divisive one now and BTW not everyone was stuck as a WB Captain for a extra 5 yrs. To top it off you voted for this marginal contract. Who knows what we might have achieved if the vote would have went the other way.
12-23-2017, 11:08 AM
#52
done, gone skiing
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Rocking chair
Posts: 1,601
Originally Posted by Fdxlag2
Yes whoever negotiated the A Plan screwed all you poor suckers who got stuck being WB captains for 10 extra years 
.
.
..... And it was only 5 extra years, and only for those who choose to do so (for no extra benefit)
12-23-2017, 11:43 AM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: 777 Captain in Training
Posts: 1,457
Originally Posted by Fdxlag2
Says the guy who wants to trade my retirement so he can a bigger chunk of the pie. BTW I am as likely as you to retire under this contract.
12-23-2017, 11:58 AM
#54
Proponent of Hysteria
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 3B
Posts: 1,052
Originally Posted by dckozak
Yes I can sense your pain for (our) plight. ..... And it was only 5 extra years, and only for those who choose to do so (for no extra benefit)
..... And it was only 5 extra years, and only for those who choose to do so (for no extra benefit)Throw me into that briar patch please.
12-23-2017, 12:03 PM
#55
Proponent of Hysteria
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 3B
Posts: 1,052
Originally Posted by dckozak
The plan is frozen. No matter how much you made last year, the previous 5, or the next 25, you will never (as things currently stand) get more than 130K. No inflationary increase (COLA) nothing. We would have to have deflation to "win" under our current plan, very, very unlikely. Most WB captains are making around 300K if they are not pushing themselves for more. That means today, without any changes and incomes based on current rates, a pilot retiring now getting at best 43.3% of his final earnings from the A plan, and thats if he is getting 130K and making only 300K. Most likely, said pilot is getting a smaller percentage than that.
I have flown with many pilots who just wanted their pension in the B plan, totally under their control, in their name and not subject to loss such as was seen by our legacy brethren not so long ago. As things stand, they are getting their wish. The question is...if we don't find some other vehicle to supplement the B plan/401K funds, will 8% now and 9% in a couple years be equivalent to retirements at UPS, UAL, DAL and SWA?
I have flown with many pilots who just wanted their pension in the B plan, totally under their control, in their name and not subject to loss such as was seen by our legacy brethren not so long ago. As things stand, they are getting their wish. The question is...if we don't find some other vehicle to supplement the B plan/401K funds, will 8% now and 9% in a couple years be equivalent to retirements at UPS, UAL, DAL and SWA?
12-23-2017, 12:05 PM
#56
Proponent of Hysteria
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 3B
Posts: 1,052
Originally Posted by dckozak
The plan is frozen. No matter how much you made last year, the previous 5, or the next 25, you will never (as things currently stand) get more than 130K. No inflationary increase (COLA) nothing. We would have to have deflation to "win" under our current plan, very, very unlikely. Most WB captains are making around 300K if they are not pushing themselves for more. That means today, without any changes and incomes based on current rates, a pilot retiring now getting at best 43.3% of his final earnings from the A plan, and thats if he is getting 130K and making only 300K. Most likely, said pilot is getting a smaller percentage than that.
I have flown with many pilots who just wanted their pension in the B plan, totally under their control, in their name and not subject to loss such as was seen by our legacy brethren not so long ago. As things stand, they are getting their wish. The question is...if we don't find some other vehicle to supplement the B plan/401K funds, will 8% now and 9% in a couple years be equivalent to retirements at UPS, UAL, DAL and SWA?
I have flown with many pilots who just wanted their pension in the B plan, totally under their control, in their name and not subject to loss such as was seen by our legacy brethren not so long ago. As things stand, they are getting their wish. The question is...if we don't find some other vehicle to supplement the B plan/401K funds, will 8% now and 9% in a couple years be equivalent to retirements at UPS, UAL, DAL and SWA?
MANY of us still have plenty of benefit to earn if the union and our brothers and sisters don't give it away like morons.
12-23-2017, 12:08 PM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 936
Originally Posted by HIFLYR
I never said that at all in any post! I have said we vote on it no matter what!
12-23-2017, 12:37 PM
#58
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Gear Monkey
Posts: 3,191
Originally Posted by Fdxlag2
..... I want to keep it that way, I just think we can improve it without scrapping it.
Research Liberally. Think Critically. Stay United!!
12-23-2017, 01:19 PM
#59
done, gone skiing
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Rocking chair
Posts: 1,601
Originally Posted by FXDX
Gee, no benefit at all to working 5 extra years as a wide body Captain? No, only about $1.5 million in earnings plus an additional $120K in B fund money to invest for those years that you could actually be saving some of to fund your retirement, on top of the $130K per year the company will pay you.
Throw me into that briar patch please.
Throw me into that briar patch please.
Originally Posted by FXDX
Absolutely not, which is why we shouldn't be ****ing around with our A fund, which is head and shoulders better than their profit sharing and 401K plans.
earnings, and I'm not chasing dollars like many.
Here is a quick look at what $130,000 will look like in a couple years. I used 3% inflation as thats been the trend lately. If we get some real inflation like in the 1970's, forget about it!
130,000 5 years from now $112,140
10 $96,732
15 $83,442
20 $71,977
Just for grins, here is what 130K would be worth, in todays dollars if we have 4% and 5% inflation over a 15 year period
4% 15 $72,184
5% 15 $62,532
Not that long from now and not impossible.
12-23-2017, 02:16 PM
#60
Proponent of Hysteria
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: 3B
Posts: 1,052
Originally Posted by dckozak
The company must beam from ear to ear when they read posts like this because they are the real winners when you work 5 more years when you otherwise might be retired drawing a pension. Another way to look at this is you give away $600,000-$650,000 in pension while continue to carry water working on the line. Yes the additional $120K gets added to your nest egg and (unmentioned) you maintain health care and some company paid insurance. But... you continue to deal with the hassles of our job, take time away from enjoying your golden years, and you do so for 60 cents on the dollar, give or take.
Look we can disagree what "frozen" means. I see you point in that you have more years to reach the full 25 year benefit. I see a diminishing wad of cash that even today is not 50% of my yearly
earnings, and I'm not chasing dollars like many.
Here is a quick look at what $130,000 will look like in a couple years. I used 3% inflation as thats been the trend lately. If we get some real inflation like in the 1970's, forget about it!
130,000 5 years from now $112,140
10 $96,732
15 $83,442
20 $71,977
Just for grins, here is what 130K would be worth, in todays dollars if we have 4% and 5% inflation over a 15 year period
4% 15 $72,184
5% 15 $62,532
Not that long from now and not impossible.
Look we can disagree what "frozen" means. I see you point in that you have more years to reach the full 25 year benefit. I see a diminishing wad of cash that even today is not 50% of my yearly
earnings, and I'm not chasing dollars like many.
Here is a quick look at what $130,000 will look like in a couple years. I used 3% inflation as thats been the trend lately. If we get some real inflation like in the 1970's, forget about it!
130,000 5 years from now $112,140
10 $96,732
15 $83,442
20 $71,977
Just for grins, here is what 130K would be worth, in todays dollars if we have 4% and 5% inflation over a 15 year period
4% 15 $72,184
5% 15 $62,532
Not that long from now and not impossible.
I don't care if you exercise your well earned seniority to continue to fly the best trips and have the first choice of vacation, that is your prerogative to keep working right up to 65.
Just don't FREEZE the best A plan in the industry for those of us who have plenty more to earn.
I'm not opposed to increasing our current A plan, or our B plan, or any other plan. I'm not worried that the company can't afford to improve our A plan, they can.
What I am opposed to is a small minority of senior guys about to retire attempting to grab a little bit more on their way out the door at the possible expense of those who will never get to that $130K, all based on a mythical plan sold by consultants with absolutely no skin in our game that will magically cost everybody less but earn us more.
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