FDX TA jumpseat changes?
 

In section 26 (General) one of the changes in your TA is;

- Ability to bump offline jumpseaters up to 1 hour prior to showtime (PBB)

What does PBB stand for?

We (ups) have absolute awful jumpseating rules, keep getting bumped left and right and we always appreciate riding on your flights. Purple is famous for the "guaranteed" jumpseat rule (within 24 hours, with some caveats of course).

The TA change would make your rules more like ours and I was wondering what precipitated the change?

Is it your company pushing for this or your line pilots not being able to get to work?

Either one would be understandable and it's your business of course. From an offline pilot's perspective it'd be a negative change but again, you guys are always great to us and we appreciate the ride each time we fly on purple!

Pilot Benefit Book. I asked the Q&A about "what's the language" but haven't seen an answer. 1 hour before showtime. . . if you were an offline would you take the chance on booking on us?

I see, thanks.

I think most commuters try to fly on their own airline because it's "easier" but if there are no flights or they've been bumped, flight got canceled, etc., etc. then they look at other options...

So to answer your question, it'd be very tough for sure but if I'm trying to ride on you guys or another airline it means my other options have already fallen through..

Of course ALL airlines can bump you at the last minute; on pax airlines however you can just walk over to a different gate or even terminal and try another flight or another airline...
For us, cargo carriers it's a little more complicated as we need to get a cab to come over to the pax side, and of course during our business hours "normal" people sleep so there aren't many pax flights to choose from..

Unfortunately, the new j/s rule would make things a little more difficult...

I've always promoted our Jumpseat as the 24 hour guaranteed except for emergency Jumpseat override.

I'm sad this is changing. I would not chance us as the last flight of day type option if I could be bumped.

We were known as always getting you there, even if a plane crumped as a sweep would drop in. This is how we "pay" for our international Jumpseat access on PAX carriers.

We've been trying to get something similar in our contract but it ain't gonna happen. They love to torture us with the constant jumpseat bumps... Their version of waterboarding... 'So you think you've listed yourself on a j/s to go home or to work? Ha ha, think again'... :(

I'm not sad if it is actually changing. Sorry. I've tried to go home on our own airline due to a schedule change and couldn't get on due to off-line folks locked in. Everyone's welcome otherwise. Been taken off of a pax jumpseat right before block-out many times.

I think that is the logic of the change. Why should one our own pilots not be able to get a j/s on our airplanes in the last 24 hours because an offline j/s has the seat booked.

I think the change isn't better. We so seldom get the change to reciprocate a jumpseat to anyone. I think it should be locked in for anyone 24hrs prior. At FedEx, we can book a jumpseat 21 days in advance. Sure, there might be some last minute changes to someone's schedule, but that is rare. Maybe the issue is that the company wants more seats open so they can deadhead us home instead of buying a ticket. That's a change to the new TA. And getting bumped last minute at FX is a little different than getting bumped off of a mainline carrier. You can't just find another flight at FX as you can often do if you are in the main airport terminal. So now if a guy gets bumped at 3am, he's got to find a place to stay or, go over to the terminal and sit some more waiting for a flight home. I think we should still have to option for an offline guy to be locked in and provide the same courtesy of giving them a ride as other carriers do us.

Anyone can be bumped in the last minute for an operational emergency. The company would probably book a j/s for deadheading back as an operational emergency.

I guess we would have to know which side asked for this change to know the original reason for the change.

Viper446, you beat me to it.

Man, I hate looking at everything in this TA through the how-will-they-screw-us-with-this-language goggles, but, it is either our NC asking for change because of our guys requesting it, or it is the company asking for the very likely reasons you state Viper446.

To whalesurfer, this is obviously a change that will not be fought if we go back to the table after rejecting the TA. And, even though I've never ridden on UPS, I am truly sorry about this change. I have always enjoyed giving offline guys the 24 hour guaranteed seat, as a minor way to thank the UA, AA, DL, Alaska, and Frontier crews that have given me countless international jumpseats, which we cannot reciprocate (although we are working on that).

I agree with this. This is sad, nobody should be bumped up to an hour prior, unless it's an emergency. I've had opportunities to bump people off, but I just chose to have FedEx buy me a commercial ticket instead, I know people count on the ride. I can see if it's some sort of emergency, or even something where a flight cancels at the last minute (or equipment change) and a FedEx pilot has no other way to get to work in time, but not just random booking at the last minute.

I suspect it does have something to do with the option the company would have as far as using jumpseats instead of tickets to book back to base (which is total BS, and we all know that they will abuse it).

Whale,
In the last few years and with the departure of a few carriers from memphis, more offline jumpseaters now ride on us. I am always happy to extend an invitation every flight and will fill every seat. But, with our current rule, one of our own must find a different way inside 24 hours if the flight is full even if it is with pilots from other airlines. It is not removing someone with seats available, its only if there aren't any more seats. As some have stated, this is common practice with every other airline. I have been in the js with the door closed to be removed. That is just business. No ill will. Home team gets preference. Our schedules change last minute as with everyone else. Personally, if the captain was really using his captain's authority, this would be cleared up each time anyway. I very much appreciate others extending the option to ride and we do the same, this is just updating an old mis-applied rule. In the past couple of years, I have seen this be an issue only once.

Viper, how is this different from what happens on the mainline. Your 3 am scenario is the worst case. No different to you being on the last flight out of Dodge and 30 sec to door closure you are removed. You gotta find a place, etc.

Pakage

Are you referring to the pretty blue lettering in the TA that has many seeing RED?

e. Deadhead by Company Aircraft to Base

Those changes listed under that section are actually making it more difficult for the company to DH us on our own Jumpseat... in our current contract on the first page of Section 8 it says:

c. Operational Deadheads
In individual cases of operational necessity and with the approval of the System Chief Pilot, a Regional Chief Pilot or the Duty Officer, a pilot may be scheduled to deadhead on a Company aircraft, chartered jet carrier, Company corporate business jet aircraft or on a scheduled U.S. certificated air carrier operating under FAR Part 135. The SIG shall be advised of the reasons for this action within 5 days of occurrence.

I only bring this up because this is one of the 3 most common misquoted parts of the TA that I heard pilots mention.

Btw my 3 day TA straw pole while in CAN came in around 50 /50.

The guaranteed offline 24 hours needs to stay. No non emergency bumping. Period.
We use way more QUANTITY of offline seats than they use on us.
The only way for us to reciprocate with a little balance is with QUALITY.

I understand and frankly for all too long yall's lock-in rules were almost too good to be true. Which is why everyone out there knows about it. I agree though that it doesn't sound right for your own guys not to be able to list themselves if a flight cancels...

Maybe a current lock-in within 24 hours for everybody else but FDX drivers would a good compromise? So an offline pilot could still list him/herself knowing only a purple pilot might take that seat away.. Just daydreaming here... Current rules were fantastic for sure...

You're absolutely right and yes, it just doesn't sound right when one of your own can't make it home because an offline pilot is listed already.. It was great while it lasted.. Many thanks!

I don't know what your 75 & 76 jumpseats look like but if you value your own wellbeing and your sanity I hope they're much better than what we've got here at brown.. :mad:

All our 75s and 76s have 4 j/seats.
On the 757 - 2 next to the lavatory + a foldable seat behind the CA and another foldable behind the FO.
767s have 3 j/seats next to the lavatory and one behind the FO which can be moved to the middle (observer seat). They're all facing forward and are absolutely awful! We get repositioned on our airplanes all the time! No bunks, if you try to sleep on the floor (767) you're always blocking the crew from using the lav and/or the kitchen.

Guys/gals do NOT give up your airline tickets for 75/76 jumpseat misery... :(

Can't seem to find the language in Section 26,
Think someone might be stirring the pot

Pretty sure our 767 is the same as yours. Our 757 is different. 3 seats behind door and one in the cockpit. The three in the back would be comfortable if they reclined. Unfortunately they don't. But at least they are not in the cockpit.

That's why I said if it actually changes. It's not in Sec 26 but it might be in the new PBB; not sure if that is out yet. This was in the synopsis document:

Section 26 General
• Raised annual uniform allowance to $200 (26.B.)
• “No harm” jumpseats expanded to all bases (26.J.)
• New expired Visa/passport notifications and validations similar to medical certificates (26.M.)
• Company manuals provided in electronic format only (26.Q.)
• Ability to bump offline jumpseaters up to 1 hour prior to showtime (PBB)
• New boarding priority system (PBB)
• Modified jumpseat suspension language (PBB)
• Removed seat blocking of jumpseats for deadheading crew members from bid packs (PBB)
• Improved new aircraft acquisition language (26.K.)
• Known Crewmember (KCM) contractually required (26.AA.)

Did anybody think that over? So if I'm list for a two leg commute through MEM, my first leg is 2.5hrs long, I can be mid flight and get bumped and be stuck in MEM at 2am. Now that's go to start a JS war.

If we get bumped off the JS, can we use our deviation bank to pay for a hotel room?

This is one more benefit that isn't quite as good as it used to be ... but it saves the Company money by allowing them to put DH pilots on the jumpseat. Heck, why not put ALL DHing pilots on the JS (especially the ones in front of the lav.

Camel ... Nose ...


:confused:

+1 .............

That bears repeating.

The guaranteed offline 24 hours needs to stay. No non emergency bumping. Period.






.

Excellent point.

See above post.






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I'm not trying to do that at all.
KnightFlyer has the same document I do. It's called "Section by Section Highlights as of August 17, 2015"



"Section 26 General
• Raised annual uniform allowance to $200 (26.B.)
• “No harm” jumpseats expanded to all bases (26.J.)
• New expired Visa/passport notifications and validations similar to medical certificates (26.M.)
• Company manuals provided in electronic format only (26.Q.)
• Ability to bump offline jumpseaters up to 1 hour prior to showtime (PBB)
• New boarding priority system (PBB)
• Modified jumpseat suspension language (PBB)
• Removed seat blocking of jumpseats for deadheading crewmembers from bidpacks (PBB)
• Improved new aircraft acquisition language (26.K.)
• Known Crewmember (KCM) contractually required (26.AA.)

Trying to figure out exactly what is in the pot is not just "stirring the pot". We need to understand what it is that's being served before we eat it.

The company needs to be able to bump guys from offline so they can put us on the jumpseat in lieu of our deadheads. Unless you are a complete idiot you know FedEx will expand on the jumpseat in lieu of deadhead concession and for those that say this is from a previous arbitration, the language in the TA is much too broad. What happened to clarity and getting the language right?

I can see trip revisions and extensions causing a deadhead to interfere with your next trip. Viola--just put you on the company jumpseat instead. We will soon be like UPS. Before you know it--scheduled company jumpseats will be the norm and scheduled deadheads a distant memory and first class deadheads will soon be an urban legend among new hires.

The company has the power to remove an offline jumpseater (or one of us) for what they consider higher priority. Guess what, getting you to work is a higher priority. This is being done daily. Tony, App, I respectfully disagree! EVERY airline fills their jumpseats first with their people. We are no different. As far as the "on your way to memphis" thing, again, no different than you connecting through DFW, ATL, etc. The big difference is they are guaranteed on ours. Star, what jumpseat war? When you get connect through say DFW, you don't even know if there is a seat with the pax carrier on the next flight and no guarantee. Now, same, same. I understand the quality thing but should it be at the expense of one of ours not getting to or from work? Some guys are constantly changing their schedule and I don't fault them for that. But as one who was at the airport when my js cancelled and the other flight was full to include an offline guy, it sucked and I didn't have deviation money to spend.

Realize the other airlines don't even guarantee their own guys. At the last minute a senior guy can come up and bump a junior guy going to work. I am not trying to be harsh, just realistic. This is not starting a war or done out of spite. This is the norm for all other companies.

So let me say it again, It needs to change.

Pakage

Whale, the company already has the power to stick people on jumpseats. I truly think offline guys getting bumped will rarely happen. But unfortunately, it is a small risk now.

Pakage, of course you make very valid points. I change my schedule often during certain months, and have been on the bad end of this deal, trying to make it home, with an offline guy on the jumpseat. But then I remember the countless international jumpseats I have taken on carriers that we cannot reciprocate with. Those AA, DL and UA crews took me and other FDXers back/forth to Europe, Central, and South America many, many times. I have always liked saying to those crews whom we cannot reciprocate with "you can book on us 24 hours out and have a guaranteed seat. You can also get our shipping discount". At least I know, from our JS chairman, that we are working on international jumpseat reciprocity.

Try getting extended in the field and then not allowed to jump home for a kids event because offline booked it 24 hours prior so they are protected then you go to same offline airline and get bumped as the door is closing for a company employee. Just part of the gig. Good change.

No I agree it is a good change. Just to keep it in perspective the company refused to recognize these valid arguments or the Captain's authority to control who rides on the airplane, even after 911. All of a sudden we introduce language which opens the door for the company to use company jumpseats instead of deadheading us (limited with loose language) and now they want to be able to kick everyone off. Now you'll be listed on the FedEx jumpseat trying to get to work and you'll get bumped for a FedEx jumpseat in lieu of deadhead. I'm sure the company would never do that!!!

I'm thinking about how much reduction in numbers of Jumpseats we will be taking over the next decade.

We will be going to a huge fleet of 100 767s which have 3 non-reclining Jumpseats next to the lav, from airplanes which have potentially 8 Jumpseats on them now.

I see the day within the next decade when all 3 Jumpseats will be filled with FedEx pilots from your city the moment the booking process opens for them. And.....there will be 3 more FedEx pilots who can't get to work....let alone any offline jumpseaters.

Why didn't we insert no harm, no foul language in anticipation of this looming shortage? Or some way to use your deviation bank to purchase a commercial ticket and the company would cover your taxes owed....or something creative.

It's very difficult to Jumpseat into Memphis anymore. Many Pinnacle and NWA/Delta guys still live here. Try jumpseating sometime with 3 FedEx guys, an offline guy, and two Delta pilots--you'll spend the day trying. The de-hubbing of Memphis changed the commuting life drastically.

I predict unintended consequences. I think people will call in sick if they can't get a Jumpseat for short trips. The increased company sick costs alone over the 25 plus years we have the 767 would more than have paid for moving the toilet, adding some Jumpseats in the back, and getting a rest area or seats. Once again, FedEx is being penny-wise and pound foolish. Imagine how much money they are also going to spend on the "can" crew rest solution and the ESO (enhanced sleep opportunity). Add that to increased sick usage costs.

Fail.

????? Seldom get to reciprocate. I have off liners on my Jumpsuits often and they are always welcome.

"sure there MAY be last minute changes to someone's schedule but that is rare" I do not know what Aircraft or Seat you are in but I looked at my past 3 months, I see a lot of revisions where my back end DH went away and I ended up in MEM at the last minute.

Viper, just curious, do you commute? Have you ever tried to book a jumpseat to DEN, ATL, DFW or SEA or ANC inside of 21 days?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy giving my Offline brethren a ride when ever, but excuse me if I think FDX Pilots should get Jumpseat Priority on a FDX Jet, I wish DL, AA UAL would allow us to reserve their Jumpseats 24 hours in advance with no chance of getting bumped. With the reduction in Realistic DH fares, reduction in DH's period, the FDX Jumpseat is becoming harder and harder to use.

There are obviously some strong opinions on both sides of the argument. It's good that we had an opportunity to voice our opinions to the Negotiating Committee via polls and surveys, and we knew what our collective stance on the issue was from the published contract Openers.


Oh, wait ...







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I brought this issue up with all my block reps through the years along with staging protection for all domiciles. Glad the NC listened.

Excellent point. In Nov the IAD-MEM goes from an MD10 to a 767. From 4-7 jumpseats down to 3. And with the govt couriers sometimes taking 2 jumpseats, it isnt going to be good.

That's interesting. The only one I seem to have is labled highlights as of TA 19 August

Actually, was this even negotiated? All the contract says is that "pilots shall be given access to Company jump seats on terms no less favorable than those provided in the Company jump seat policy effective January 25, 1998 and included in the PBB. Procedures for booking and other provisions governing access to Company jump seats shall be as provided in that policy."

The way I see it, since this change refers to offline pilots, not our pilots, the company could change it on their own without asking us. Not sure if that's the way it happened though.