Can I log hours towards my PPL in EU?
02-12-2024, 01:51 PM
#1
New Hire
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2022
Posts: 5
Can I log hours towards my PPL in EU?
I am active duty military still working on my PPL. I was on orders to go on an EU rotation later this year, but they just pushed those orders up. I will be leaving a lot sooner now and doubt I will be able to finish my PPL before I leave.
The questions are:
Can I even fly (with an instructor of course) in the EU as an American student pilot?
Will (if allowed) any of those hours count towards my PPL in the US?
I am not trying to get my license in the EU, just dont want to go 6 or more months without flying.
The questions are:
Can I even fly (with an instructor of course) in the EU as an American student pilot?
Will (if allowed) any of those hours count towards my PPL in the US?
I am not trying to get my license in the EU, just dont want to go 6 or more months without flying.
02-12-2024, 06:52 PM
#2
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,293
US air bases used to have flying clubs, including overseas.
Yes you can log time overseas, but for FAA PPL purposes it will need to be with an FAA certificated CFI, or under the supervsion of such for solo.
Yes you can log time overseas, but for FAA PPL purposes it will need to be with an FAA certificated CFI, or under the supervsion of such for solo.
02-12-2024, 08:15 PM
#3
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,026
You can cerainly log hours, and instruction received toward learning how to fly moves you toward knowing and understanding flying. Whether it moves you toward pilot certification is another matter.
Flight instruction logged toward our FAA private pilot certificate must be with an authorized instructor, as defined by 14 CFR 1.1 (https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.1)
While you can log flight time from a foreign instructor, only instrution received from an FAA-certificated flight instructor will be applicable toward your FAA private pilot certification. Where the regulation states that the instructor must be certificated "under Part 61 of this chapter," it means a FAA-certificated instructor.
Regarding the aircraft, 14 CFR 61.51(j) (https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.51) establishes what aircraft are required for logging time toward your FAA private pilot certificate:
Flight instruction logged toward our FAA private pilot certificate must be with an authorized instructor, as defined by 14 CFR 1.1 (https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.1)
Authorized instructor means—
(i) A person who holds a ground instructor certificate issued under part 61 of this chapter and is in compliance with § 61.217, when conducting ground training in accordance with the privileges and limitations of his or her ground instructor certificate;
(ii) A person who holds a flight instructor certificate issued under part 61 of this chapter and is in compliance with § 61.197, when conducting ground training or flight training in accordance with the privileges and limitations of his or her flight instructor certificate; or
(iii) A person authorized by the Administrator to provide ground training or flight training under part 61, 121, 135, or 142 of this chapter when conducting ground training or flight training in accordance with that authority.
(i) A person who holds a ground instructor certificate issued under part 61 of this chapter and is in compliance with § 61.217, when conducting ground training in accordance with the privileges and limitations of his or her ground instructor certificate;
(ii) A person who holds a flight instructor certificate issued under part 61 of this chapter and is in compliance with § 61.197, when conducting ground training or flight training in accordance with the privileges and limitations of his or her flight instructor certificate; or
(iii) A person authorized by the Administrator to provide ground training or flight training under part 61, 121, 135, or 142 of this chapter when conducting ground training or flight training in accordance with that authority.
Regarding the aircraft, 14 CFR 61.51(j) (https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.51) establishes what aircraft are required for logging time toward your FAA private pilot certificate:
(j) Aircraft requirements for logging flight time. For a person to log flight time, the time must be acquired in an aircraft that is identified as an aircraft under § 61.5(b), and is—
(1) An aircraft of U.S. registry with either a standard or special airworthiness certificate;
(2) An aircraft of foreign registry with an airworthiness certificate that is approved by the aviation authority of a foreign country that is a Member State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation Organization;
(3) A military aircraft under the direct operational control of the U.S. Armed Forces; or
(4) A public aircraft under the direct operational control of a Federal, State, county, or municipal law enforcement agency, if the flight time was acquired by the pilot while engaged on an official law enforcement flight for a Federal, State, County, or Municipal law enforcement agency.
(1) An aircraft of U.S. registry with either a standard or special airworthiness certificate;
(2) An aircraft of foreign registry with an airworthiness certificate that is approved by the aviation authority of a foreign country that is a Member State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation Organization;
(3) A military aircraft under the direct operational control of the U.S. Armed Forces; or
(4) A public aircraft under the direct operational control of a Federal, State, county, or municipal law enforcement agency, if the flight time was acquired by the pilot while engaged on an official law enforcement flight for a Federal, State, County, or Municipal law enforcement agency.
02-15-2024, 09:29 AM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2007
Position: Sr. VP of button pushing
Posts: 2,730
How about 61.41 -
(1) A flight instructor of an Armed Force blah blah blah
(2) A flight instructor who is authorized to give such training by the licensing authority of a foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation, and the flight training is given outside the United States.
(b) A flight instructor described in paragraph (a) of this section is only authorized to give endorsements to show training given.
The foreign instructor can teach you stalls or hood work or whatever and that counts towards the 20 hours of dual received but they can't sign you for the checkride is the way I read that.
61.41 Flight training received from flight instructors not certificated by the FAA.
(a) A person may credit flight training toward the requirements of a pilot certificate or rating issued under this part, if that person received the training from:(1) A flight instructor of an Armed Force blah blah blah
(2) A flight instructor who is authorized to give such training by the licensing authority of a foreign contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation, and the flight training is given outside the United States.
(b) A flight instructor described in paragraph (a) of this section is only authorized to give endorsements to show training given.
The foreign instructor can teach you stalls or hood work or whatever and that counts towards the 20 hours of dual received but they can't sign you for the checkride is the way I read that.
02-15-2024, 03:57 PM
#6
All is fine at .79
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Position: Paahlot
Posts: 4,089
By the way there are a lot of FAA certified instructors scattered allover Europe.
In any case flight time will count towards your total time in case you’re looking at doing your CPL later.
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...section-61.129
In any case flight time will count towards your total time in case you’re looking at doing your CPL later.
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...section-61.129
02-16-2024, 05:20 PM
#8
All is fine at .79
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Position: Paahlot
Posts: 4,089
Originally Posted by RonW
Thanks everyone. I've been looking for schools near where I'll be at. Hopefully I'll be able to continue receiving training while I'm there. Even if it just counts towards total time, that's still a win in my book!
As long as it is properly documented in your logbook.
Keep in mind that (powered) flight time in NW Europe is much more expensive as Avgas is much more expensive (upwards of €4/liter)and taxes can be upwards of 40% on ‘luxury’ expenditures such as useless hobbies.
As well as separate take off and landing fees depending on it being the home field where the aircraft is registered to an ‘out’-field for a cross country.
02-19-2024, 07:02 AM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2011
Posts: 517
Originally Posted by RonW
Thanks everyone. I've been looking for schools near where I'll be at. Hopefully I'll be able to continue receiving training while I'm there. Even if it just counts towards total time, that's still a win in my book!
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