ctab5060X

"If you're faced with a forced landing, fly the thing as far into the crash
as possible."
- Bob Hoover

"If an airplane is still in one piece, don't cheat on it. Ride the bastard
down."
- Ernest K. Gann

"When a prang seems inevitable, endeavor to strike the softest, cheapest
object in the vicinity, as slowly and gently as possible."
- advice given to RAF pilots during WWII

If the good engine hasn't given up on me, why should I give up on it? The power it is producing might be the difference in safely landing in a field, pasture, etc. versus dying in trees, powerlines, houses. If you are trained properly for flying a twin, then flying on one engine is not letting the airplane control the crash...throttling back and making the airplane a several thousand pound glider is.

mike734

Excuse me, opposite rudder? Have you ever done this before?

ctab5060X

Sorry, guess I should clarify...that would be opposite rudder from your engine that has failed (dead foot, dead engine principal) as a compared to opposite rudder from the bank into the good engine. Sorry about the confusion.

And yes, I have and proud of it (sarcasm)

Seriously, it was part of my multi training. My instructor witnessed a pilot on a checkride step on the wrong rudder (initial engine failure on departure portion) that resulted in a situation where the twin they were flying nearly clipped the airport beacon and roof of the FBO. Therefore, part of my training was to climb to a safe altitude, simulate a departure climb, retard power on the left engine, and step on the left rudder. It is scary how fast the airplane yaws and wants to drop out from under you. I can only imagine how scary it would be to do it close to the ground!

p.s. I have edited my previous post to help clairfy the mixup.

sigep_nm

Let me make this easier for you. Slower airspeed (transition for landing) aircraft barely flying as is, probably a high pitch attitude, high power setting (obviously as stated before we are trying to climb) = Probably more rudder than you got, which tada = aircraft crashed and upside down on runway (stall) or aircraft crashed upside down off the side of the runway (loss of directional control). Closing the throttle and dead sticking it in solves it all. If it wont climb then you have to eat the sh89 on your plate and deal with it. As far as obstructions and stuff that you were talking about, probably should have planned for those to begin with. But I wouldnt expect an amatuer to look that far ahead.

mike734

I've always found, "Working foot, Working engine" worked better for me. And yes, it is shocking how fast it can all fall apart if you step on the wrong engine.

I was in sim training one time with some fellow EMB-120 pilots as an observer. We were checking out for a small European carrier. Everyone was supposed to be current and qualified. One guy, who was checking out as an FO, totally screwed up the V1 cut. We just barely got airborne and he got in to some sort of Pilot induced yaw to the point that he lost control. The last thing I remember seeing out the window was two rows of vertical lights (the runway). It was a sickening feeling. BOOM. It happened so fast the instructor forgot the crash inhibit switch. He failed to fly a V1 cut 8 more times in a row. He went home that night.

ctab5060X

I am not saying land the airplane with full throttle on your good engine. That is not even done when you lose an engine en route or approaching the airport for landing. All I am saying is don't be so darn quick to yank the good engine you have remaining in an effort to maintain control.

As far as stall or a Vmc roll (more than likely you will get to Vmc before a full blown departure stall condition), what the heck are you doing that slow to begin with? Look at #2 in my original post...pitch for blue line. 90% of the time this will be a pitch down, not up. Yes, you will have a degradation of airspeed, but if you wait until you are closer to VYse on the takeoff roll, you will have a larger margin of error when it comes to airspeed degradation resulting in a few more seconds to let the good engine have a chance to help rather than yanking the power back and giving up so quickly.

You talk about maintaining control, yet your procedure of "dead sticking" (of course you know this means killing the good engine completely, no power available at all now), you have made the airplane a huge flying brick and taken all control out of the situation and given it over to an airplane (primary job is to kill you) and a higher power (depending on your beliefs).

As far as obstructions are concerned, you should treat every multi engine departure as if you are going to lose an engine at the worst possible time. Not only is this good common sense, but it is also good preflight planning. Knowing the area immediately around the airport is just a vital as for multi engine flight as checking the oil in your engines and draining your fuel sumps.

Do what you like, but for me, I am not giving up on that engine...just because I am not climbing, doesn't mean I am not maintaining altitude.

FlyingChipmunk

If I was unable to maintain altitude with the inop engine feathered and the operative engine at full power I would personnally run that good engine at full power until the crash at Vxse climb angle.

My theory is the slower I am when I crash the more likely I am to survive. Running the engine at full power will give me the best vertical speed for the airspeed (in this case slowest descent). With any luck ground effect will cushion the vertical drop a touch.

Its a trade off, of course you could pitch for vyse and have a higher airpeed and lower sink rate but chance are you are going to hit an obstacle in front of you before running into something directly below you.

Just the way I see it..