Originally Posted by Jason4275

I wear Glasses and contacts but plan to get eye surgery this year im allitle farsighted but not require to drive with my Glasses or Contacts

I know you don't want to go military because because of the 8-10 years of traning then go looking for a job i rather spend 10 years building my life buying a home a car.

I dont know anyone in the avation industry after I get my degree If I start cargo ups fedex dhl i will probably have to be a co-pilot I mean thats how you start off right

So if I work my ass of in college and get my BA, MD, JD, and MBA but they only want to pay me to start as much as someone with a AA degree


Why do most Pilot Training Flight School offer people Flight instructor jobs after there finish traning, that one thing I never want to do.

Any know or how to find out the Statistics, on how many pilots job are needed by city and state, and most important how many pilots per year retire every year Statistics from the year 2000 from the Regional Airline or Major Airline. I email the FAA about 4 times with 4 different email address about this and got no reply

Also I forgot to mention im African American

Originally Posted by SkyHigh

No matter who you are or how hard you try it is still a long and hard road. The pay is low and getting lower. There are few short cuts and the odds are against career success. I would become a dentist.

SkyHigh

Originally Posted by rickair7777

Vision: If you can see OK with glasses/contacts, I would recomend NOT getting the vision surgery. Vision surgery can actually reduce your best visual acuity. The FAA requires you to see 20/20, but it's ok to wear your glasses for the eye test. Surgery could lower your best vision with or without glasses to 20/25 which is a no-go.

Military: If you can somehow qualify, DO IT! You will get paid FAR MORE if you spend your first ten years of aviation in the military. Your average civilian pilot pay during those ten years would probably be $25K (minus what you paid for training). Your average military pay would probably be $80K. You would be making well over $100K by the time you reach ten in the military. Just stay out of helicopters...

Copilot: Now called first officer, that is where you start at pretty much any airline or cargo job (except small planes where you are the ONLY pilot).

Degree: Finish your AA first, that will help get you a regional job. But PLAN on finishing the 4 year at some point to get to a major (cargo or pax).

Knowing Someone: You will meet lots of people working at your various aviation jobs.

Flight Instruction: There are a few schemes out there to avoid this, but they cost big $$$$ and are risky (do you feel lucky?). Flight instruction is often fun, sometimes not, looks great on your resume, and is the accepted way to gain experience in the industry if you didn't do the military.

Pilot Jobs: Geography has nothing to do with it, you are extremely unlikely to get an airline job in your hometown (unless you live in Newark, NJ lol). Very few pilots are this lucky. When you get hired at an airline, your company will usually have several bases and you can work out of whichever one you like if you have the seniority. Many pilots commute from other cities (free travel on ANY US airline), including me. You can get a flight instruction job anywhere, and probably get a night cargo job in your general area. There will be LOTS of pilot retirements in the next 5 years for sure as many Vietnam Vet ex-miitary pilots retire.

Being a minority will CERTAINLY help you get an interview at a regional and eventually major airline. You probably wouldn't even need a recomendation. It would also help you get in the military. You still have to prove you're a good pilot.

My recomendation would be find a local school or FBO, take the Private Pilot ground school, then start taking lessons. If you enjoy flying, then pursue the career. It started out as a hobby for me, and I'm a lot happier (despite all of the industry turmoil) than some other folks who did it for the $$$.

Originally Posted by Jason4275

Are Aviation mechanics paid more than the pilots.

Strange their would be more flight schools that Aviation mechanics schools

Originally Posted by Jason4275

You said that military pilots get payed 80k to 100k im sure you not talking about the air force cargo pilots, im sure you probally talking about the small percent of people who fly the Lockheed F/A-22 Raptor and the B-2 STEALTH BOMBER.

Its too late for the military im 22 now 23 in december and I should of join the military when I was 18

I dont want to insult the older pilots or sound rude, but I hope they get rid of the old veitnam pilots because I will need their job soon.

Originally Posted by gringo

Atuall, all things considered, an Air Force (or Marine or Navy or whatever) cargo pilot makes MORE money than a fighter/attack pilot. They get the same perdiem and what not, but they're on the road a lot more, flying a LOT more and therefore making more perdiem. Your typical attac/fighter jock flies around 200 hours a year, more or less, while your typical cargo pilot flying rubber doodie-doo can make 3 times as much. I know of one Harrier guy in the Corps who got out after 10 years with just over 1500 hours total!

Either way, from reading your posts, it seems that you're expecting a career in aviation to be far more rewarding (at least financially) than your IT career. Hate to break it to you, but it's nowhere what it used to be. You're gonna be stuck in the poorhouse for a long long long time. If you don't belive me, just spend 6 months reading the posts in the Regional thread. Almost all of them start off with something that sounds like "The company's stickin it to us again..." or "why do we get paid squat..." or "this schedule blows... AGAIN!!!"

You mentioned that you're black- that could be a positive, anyway. If you're black, or a woman, or an american indian, (or best yet, all three!) you're set- there are tons of scholorships available. If you're a white man, forget it. You gotta pay your own way.

Don't worry about the vision thing- I'm 20/400 and I have no problem. Yeah, I don't like the glasses, and contacts work (just carry some rewetting drops with you all the time) but I'm not quite ready to laze my eyes.

Also, if you ever decide to go the military route (which I still think is your best bet!) the Air Force won't take you with Lasik, only PRK. The navy and Marines will take Lasik, though.

Finish your degree. While working on your degree, get your instructor ratings and build some time that way. By the time you get your BS, you'll be either very close to finding a job (forget about livable wage- unless you like sharing an apartment with 6 other guys) or deciding to go another route.

Air Force or Navy are still the best route. Your eyesight can be 20/70. Cargo will get you around the world- you'll get to see some pretty cool places and do some amazing stuff (I know- I was a Navigator on a C-130) and if my eyesight was better I would have jumped at the opportunity to go back as an officer. Quite honestly, you'd be a fool if you don't take that opportunity. A poor fool, with debt up to your eyeballs, but a fool none the less.

Either way, good luck and GET THAT DEGREE! You're still very young, and you have plent of time.

Originally Posted by rickair7777

Jason,

The route to cargo and the airlines is essentially the same in the beginning. There are VERY few possible shortcuts, but many people will likely try to sell you one for a great deal of $$$. There are NO valid shortcut programs in the LA area, so if you're going to hang out there, here's what you will need to do. Anyone who says anything different is going to try to sell you an expensive training program.

Self-evaluate:I am OK with math?
I am OK with technical things?
I am a good people person, who is ASSERTIVE?
I am I in good health?
Do I have a decent driving record (NO DUIs)?
Am I free of any criminal convictions? (MINOR stupidity in your distant past might be ok)

If you answer no to any of the above you will probably spend a lot of $$$ and go nowhere.

Find an Aviation Medical Examiner
Get a FIRST CLASS medical (not a 2nd or third)

Flight school. Check out the internet, and go visit several in your area. A school with a 141 program MIGHT save you a little money. The training you will need is:

Private Pilot ($8000)
Instrument Rating ($6000) MS Flight Sim is a useful practice tool.
Commercial License ($15000)
Commercial Multi-engine Rating ($3000)
Cert Flight Instructor CFI ($3000)
Instrument Instructor ($2500)

The prices are very rough estimates, and will be higher if you do a lot of your training in a twin engine aircraft.

CFI Now you have around 300 hours total time (TT) and 15 multi-engine (ME)and can get a job as a flight instructor (CFI). To get a job at the next level you will need about 1000 TT, and 100 ME. The TT will come within 12-18 months as a CFI. The ME time may be harder, but you can buy it ($$$) or get a ME instructor license and get a job as ME instructor. I believe ATP does a lot of your initial training in a twin, so you might already have 100 ME.

Night Cargo At this point you can get a job flying "night cargo". This will be single pilot, night, bad weather, mountain flying, in small old, worn out airplanes with a high FATALITY rate. The pay is miserable, there are NO benefits, and you work constantly. This is probably not what you had in mind as a career destination...however if you like it you can eventually move up to 2 pilot mid-size aircraft (mostly propellor) and you will make a marginal income with some benefits, but nothing great.

Regional Airline. When you have reached 1500-2500 TT and 300-500 ME (within 1 year, if you survive), you can work for a regional airline. You will start in either turboprops or regional jets (RJs)and after 3-5 years become an RJ captain. This is much safer and more comfortable than your previous aviation jobs. Better money, work rules and time off. After a couple years as an RJ captain, you can apply to a Major airline...

Major Airline. Now the confusing thing about major airlines, is that this includes all the BIG cargo operators (UPS, FEDEX, DHL, ATLAS, etc) who operate large turbojet aircraft. These operators work just like passenger airlines in many ways and have good pay & benefits. However they are just as competetive, probably more so today, as any passenger airline when it comes to pilot hiring. If you want to work for any major airline (cargo or pax) plan on excelling in every way during your aviation career. You'll need a 4 year degree to get to this level also.

One possible shortcut is to skip Night Cargo and go from CFI directly to a Regional Airline (I did this). You will need some opportunity to work as a multi-engine instructor to do this. Be advised that a "Commercial Pilot License" really does not qualify you to do anything other than to work as a flight instructor after you get your CFI ratings. There are a few possible shortcuts (does your dad own a private jet?), but for most of us the path I described above is the reality. Good Luck