I am new to this forum and it seems like this is a good place for information. I currently go to Phoenix East Aviation in Daytona Beach, Fl. It is an accredited flight school under 141 ops. I like the school and I dont pay a boat load for my training but it is going super slow. Everyone keeps telling me to check out ATP. I already have my PPL and my Instrument and i am working on my multi commercial. I am wondering how much a student can learn in a 14 day CFI class. It seems like it would me a super quick memorization of the course the check ride and then off to teach students with little Instructing experience. How can this be benificial besides saving time? Thanks, Jason

 

I was once told by a very experienced pilot, "that if you want to fly like a 1000 hour pilot, you need to fly 1000 hours". The point of course was that there isn't a shortcut for experience. Can you be coached to pass a check ride in 14 days? Of course! Will you learn everything required or have the experience to operate in the "real world", I doubt it.

In the interviews I've conducted, the zero-to-hero profile looks good on paper but I find that they come up short in judgement area because they have very little experience. In other words, they don't know what they don't know. In terms of hiring that profile, I'd pass.

 

I looked at the ATP CFI course, and after talking to many people who have gone there, I decided to stay at my FBO. They can get you to pass the test, but they won't get you to a point that you need to be to instruct students. I was told that you should go into the 14 day program with most of the knowledge already, and that almost defeats the purpose in my oppinion. I wanted to work at my FBO as an instructor and they said from what they have seen from ATP CFIs, I would still have a lot of training that I would need to do before they would let me instruct their students.

ATP has their place, you can get your ratings in a hurry, but there is a difference in having the rating or certificate, and having all the information needed to use that rating or certificate safely.

If you feel like things are taking too long, talk to your instructor and see what you can work out. They should be willing to work with you, if they aren't look at all your other options, ATP as well as other FBOs in the area.

 

Well said...I've been having issues with new hires at my company with just this problem...No experience in my airlines operation...Flying the globe is much harder then just flying in the States, but I'm talking about guys/gals with time in RJ's...1000's of hours of jet time and they can't even find a correct HF frequency to make a position report...Experience can only be achieved by achieving experience...Now I would most likely be a screw up in their operation too!...lol

 

Well hell, whether you went to ATP or not, from what I just read here is that you can't fly like a 1000 hour pilot until you get a 1000 hours anyway. so does it really matter which school you went to unless you can get that 1000 hours and be a pro. The faster you can get all of your ratings, the faster you can began to repay the massive loan! i went to ATP and i am a very safe pilot. Just like everybody, i don't know everything....( And more and likely never will) However, i do know that what makes a good pilot is alot of hard work and studying. And like everbody has said, "EXPERIENCE". So, that being said, of course the guys that go to ATP do not know everything, hell they just finished school and started working. But I will tell you this, most of the guys in my class will know a whole hell of alot pretty soon! It takes a little bit of dedication to the job to finish that quick, no matter how mad that may make some people.

So to close, "All pilots become better pilots with the help of other pilots".

P.S. I didn't like half of the guys that I met at ATP. But that does not mean that they are all idiots.

 

First of all you have no idea what you are talking about. The two week program at ATP is based on you, the prospective student, doing alot of prep before showing up. No one can learn how to teach or all the crap that you need to know in two weeks. Second, ATP does not know exactly who you are getting for the checkride, the FSDO assigns that. They have a good idea who though. What you do in that two weeks, is talk about what the PTS requires for the checkride, go over this CFI pretest that they send you when you sign up the course, go over some FARs, and do alot of lesson plans. You also have a good chuck of flight time to take care of. Ground school is from 8am until the instructor feels like letting you go, sometimes 6-8pm. The guy who teaches the course in JAX is Walt Schamel. He is an FAA Master Instructor and helped write the PTS and the FARs. He also teaches DPE ground school. He is well known throughout the aviation community. So unless you really know what you are talking about, I would keep my mouth shut.

 

From what ctd57 says, I am glad that I went the FBO flight school route. I knew who my DE would be (had to give the FSDO first chance, but they are so busy, I knew they would say no). He says that you have to do a lot of prep work before showing up, I was told by people who have gone there to almost be ready knowledge wise when you go, my thought, if I have the knowledge already, why am I going to pay that much for the little bit that they have left to do. I can read the PTS myself, I don't have to pay to go through it, I can teach every lesson in the PTS to someone for free, or even pay an instructor hourly and get out for less money.

After thinking it through and talking to a few people who did the career program, I didn't go to ATP, and I am glad that I didn't.

This is what I have heard and my personal conclusions. I am not making any definate statements here.

 

Why are you glad you didn't attend ATP? They get the job done at a fixed cost without the frustrations associated with FBOs...

Sincerely,
LAFF

 

For the reasons that I stated in my prior post. If I need to go into the program with the knowledge already, what is the point? I have a good FBO so I don't see the frustrations as being an issue with going to them. I knew who my DE would be, so I could study from the gouges from his checkrides. I heard from many people who have gone to ATP that they get you the certificate, but don't make you ready to instruct. Even though ATP has fixed costs, I got done for less money at my FBO. I had a lot of reasons, these are just a few.

Shaun

 

Nothing / no-one will prepare you to CFI. You have to do it to learn how to do it. Congratulations on saving $$$ by going to a good FBO. I gave up on FBOs after my PPL. They are too depressing for my blood. I felt bad when my CFI told me the boss paid him only $8 an hour but was doing him a big favor by letting him work there and log precious C-172 PIC time...

-LAFF