Special K

Hey everyone,
I have a quick question for those who may have had their AGI before CFI. I have heard that if you get your AGI before CFI that the DPE or FAA Inspector may skip over or cover very little of the fundamentals of instruction part of the PTS. Do you think it is worthwhile getting the AGI certificate before my CFI for this purpose? Thanks!

IDIOTPILOT

You don't skip any portion of the Fundamentals of Instruction on the checkride. The only difference is instead of the FOI knowledge test results, you simply show your AGI certificate. The only time FOI can be skipped on a flight instructor checkride is if you already possess a flight instructor certificate, not AGI. If you had a CFII and wanted to add CFI then you would not have to do FOI. Reference the additional rating task table of the PTS to see what allows what. This is the only documented way to skip portions.

EVpilot

I had my AGI and my initial CFI coered everything including the FOI. You need to go to your CFI prepared to explain everything in the PTS. This cannot be overstressed. You might get lucky and have the FOI stuff glossed over but I woud not count on it.

Special K

Gotcha! Thanks for the replies!

rickair7777

An examiner, can at his discretion, cover anything he wants from the PTS, including FOI's for those who already have an instructor cert. Be prepared unless you know the examiner really well.

TI 3VOM

I had my AGI prior to getting my CFI for this reason. During the beginning of the checkride, the examiner asked me to show him my FOI written. I told him I no longer had it as I had an AGI. I showed him the AGI, and he literally took about 20 pages of questions out of his binder of things to ask on the oral and threw it in the garbage. He was very happy to do this, as he said it cut out over 3 hours off the ground. All the questions he threw away were on FOIs. He told me that since I had my AGI, I was already an instructor, so he did not have to test me on any of the FOI knowledge, however he could if he chose to.

This was an FAA examiner, not a DPE.

Paying the extra $100 to take the AGI written was totally worth it to me in this case, but I have heard not all examiners do this.

nestor2k

I'm planning to take the AGI & IGI as soon I get home from OEF, followed by the ATP, then CFI. That's good news if I end up taking the CFI checkride one day. Hope for the best, plan for the worst.

Bellanca

I've heard that, but it is so dependent on what areas the examiner likes to test (as is the rest of the oral and checkride). Some examiners like to hammer on the FOI, and others don't want to deal with it avoid it like the plague.

I didn't have my AGI, but before the oral officially started the examiner was asking me general 'make conversation' questions about myself (where are you from, where did you get your ratings, where did you go to school, etc). When I mentioned that one my majors in college was psychology he was like "well we can skip the FOI, its all psychology". We totally skipped the FOI pages of the PTS, but went item by item over most of the other knowledge areas. The only FOI-related things he ever asked was some scenario-type questions that involved knowing some very basic knowledge of FOI stuff like "what if a student is having a really hard time understanding some area of ground knowledge, what different things would you try to get through to them?" and 'What if your student is getting frustrated with a maneuver, what would you do to minimize their frustrations?"

DanielS224

I am sitting in the lobby of the FBO, having just walked out of the room where my CFI candidate is currently speaking with the DPE. I was as surprised as anyone when the DPE stated that by virtue of his Advanced Ground Instructor certificate, an hour was just cut from the oral. The DPE stated that this is in the PTS, but I have not been able to find it. I agree with all previous comments that you must be prepared for EVERYTHING. Take NOTHING for granted.

I am a full-time teacher. When it was my turn for the CFI initial checkride, the examiner stated, "Since you're a teacher, you probably know more about this stuff than I do, but I still have to ask you something about FOI." Knowing the FAA's information on educational theory is incredibly outdated, we both just jumped through the required hoops and moved on.

JohnBurke

When you obtain your AGI, you will have demonstrated nothing. You will have taken two knowledge exams, and filled out a form. That's it. Obtaining the AGI, then, has done nothing to require you to demonstrate your understanding of teaching.

Showing an examiner or inspector your AGI tells him nothing about your understanding of teaching or ability to teach. The examiner is responsible for determining that you can teach and that you do understand the precepts thereof.

Accordingly, holding an advanced ground instructor certificate won't shorten your practical test for a flight instructor certificate.