hypoxia

Absolutely!

bcaviator

The K-state degree program COMBINED with the flight training, lead by a very competent and industry connected faculty/staff, is what allowed me to obtain an internship and a subsequent full time position, at 700 hours total time, which provided me with several type ratings and has enabled me to be where I am now; three Years closer to retirement with 2100tt 1700PIC 1000Turbine, making more money than I ever planned flying 500 hours a year, seeing cool places, yet spending 19/20 nights in my own bed. I can't attribute it to anything except the guidance provided by K-state, and a little luck on my end.
I'm not meaning to argue that "aviation degrees are awesome", I have my backup plans in place. So...yeah...don't misinterpret my words.

EMAW and congrats to the program for achieving this waiver!!

hypoxia

Big difference was "in the past" they were training First Officers! Correct me if I am wrong but my understanding is the pilot now has to be trained to pass the "Captain's" checkride unless of course it is water downed which makes this whole process a sham?

With all due respect, that requires a hell of a lot more "experience" than flying a Katana around for a 1000 hours and all the "mentoring" in the world won't make up for it!

Note: My comments are not directed at K-State or any school in particular but the "new process" in general!

bcaviator

I very much agree! I don't like using total time because it isn't apples to apples. That being said, KSU has a CRJ700 FTD with which they do CRM training, Advanced aircraft systems training, and loft style flying in. In addition, they use bonanzas for complex and barons for multi. They also have a C90 which the students get to fly right seat in for KSU faculty transportation.
That's just the beginning. So you're right. That vs 1000 hours spinning circles just don't compare. And it's being recognized with this waiver.

hypoxia

I browsed the K-State website and I am impressed! Integrating airline style training from the start is exactly what is needed to arm the pilot with the ability to pass a PIC type rating at 1000 hours total flight time!

NWA320pilot

Not criticizing but what is the real world experience level in relation to airline flying by K state instructors?

bcaviator

For the average instructor that may be exaggerated a bit, however the instructor/professor who teaches a lot of the advanced classes has several years in the airlines on the CRJ and Saab.

WeHaveWhiskey

I'm a graduate of a school similar to K state and the school applied for its exemption as well. I fall right into the R-ATP window (1100TT, 115ME) and have received job offers from some regionals.

I know the prevailing opinion is the college is no substitute for experience, and I agree with that partially. But 6 years ago I couldn't keep an instructor for my commercial MEL because they were all getting to be 250 hour pilots leaving for the airlines.

Is anyone in the same boat as me?

hypoxia

In my 25 year airline career, I've flown with low time pilots that were outstanding! I've also flown with 10,000 hour pilots that were horrible! The fact is, this new R-ATP and ATP requirements means that if you have the new minimums, you are eligible for employment. Does that make the new first officer a safer and more competent pilot? Probably not! It does however, force the regional airlines to consider any and all applicants that have the "new minimums" because there are no other options!

If a pilot had 250 hours and was exceptional then I would love to fly with him or her. However, this is the new standard and only time will tell if it produces "safer" pilots. I have my doubts for a number of reasons! Becoming an airline pilot has become financially out of reach for many. Hence, only military pilots, "rich kids" or those who are stupid enough to incur 6 digits worth of student loans will ever become airline pilots!

pete2800

This! I came out of an aviation university as a hot-shot who thought he could fly airplanes. Flying a Champ without an electrical system was a humbling experience. I can say that I'm a much better pilot due to my time spent screwing around in little old fabric-covered machines than I ever was coming out of a 141 training environment.