Washington State options
04-04-2014, 12:54 AM
#1
New Hire
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
Washington State options
I'm a senior in college in the Seattle, Washington area and I'm considering pursuing a career as a commercial pilot. I've read a lot of the information on here already, including the blog linked to in the pinned topic. My interests in aviation probably began when I was a little kid and my mom was a flight attendant.
I'm specifically wondering about the costs - I have about 15k I could put toward training, but the FBOs in the area state about 40k for the complete costs from private pilot to multi-engine rating. Is there a good option to finance that cost? I've seen "Pilot Financing" and Sallie Mae suggested but the payments and interest on those seem very high.
The other choice for me, besides just saving up to pay for it out of pocket (could take years), would be to enroll in an associate's degree in commercial piloting program at one of the community colleges in the state, even though I will have a bachelor's degree already. Big Bend CC in Moses Lake seems to have a good program, with Japan Airlines training their pilots there. I could get federal loans that way.
Would welcome advice from anyone that has suggestions or experience in Washington State.
I'm specifically wondering about the costs - I have about 15k I could put toward training, but the FBOs in the area state about 40k for the complete costs from private pilot to multi-engine rating. Is there a good option to finance that cost? I've seen "Pilot Financing" and Sallie Mae suggested but the payments and interest on those seem very high.
The other choice for me, besides just saving up to pay for it out of pocket (could take years), would be to enroll in an associate's degree in commercial piloting program at one of the community colleges in the state, even though I will have a bachelor's degree already. Big Bend CC in Moses Lake seems to have a good program, with Japan Airlines training their pilots there. I could get federal loans that way.
Would welcome advice from anyone that has suggestions or experience in Washington State.
04-04-2014, 05:37 AM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left and Right of Whatever
Posts: 406
Hi there. I am a CFI in WA and have been flying both civlian and military in the state for the last 13 years. I have taught at several different schools, and I should be able to give you a good idea.
#1. When you say Seattle, do actually mean Seattle proper? A lot of folks say Seattle when they mean Everett or Tacoma because no one knows where that is.
I can offer a few suggestions.
First, understand that you are going to need more cash. A PPL alone will probably take a good chunk out of what already have saved. That being said, with the weather getting better and you having the funding you should be able to start now and be flying by yourself by the summer if you are dedicated and don't screw around.
The question always comes up, school or club? I think you get a better bang for your buck with an established club. You could look at Evergreen Flying Club out of Renton, or Valley Fliers out of Auburn. I have worked with both of them and they are good, well established groups with a robust CFI base of folks who know the area well.
Schools. Anything established at BFI is going to be expensive. So, I would avoid. You can look at Alternate Air if you want, but be sure the equipment is solid. I haven't worked with them in years.
Renton has three schools: Pro-Flight, Rainier, and BEFA. Personally, I would go with Rainier to start. They have newer, albeit slightly more expensive equipment but they seem a little more 21st-Century geared.
15k should be enough to get you through a 141 ASEL IFR Program. After that, you are going to pretty much be on your own to get the required time to move to commercial.
Like I said before, don't screw around. The spring / summer flying season is here. Fly as much as you can during the week and don't scrimp on ground lessons.
Don't finance. Do you hear me? DO NOT FINANCE. Do not beat yourself into debt for an industry that isn't paying a livable wage for what you had to do to get into it. Work like hell, save up, and pay cash. That way, when you have all the ratings and no debt, it won't matter what you are making.
No one cares what your time is in. Fly the hell out of a cheap 150 or 152 to build total time.
#1. When you say Seattle, do actually mean Seattle proper? A lot of folks say Seattle when they mean Everett or Tacoma because no one knows where that is.
I can offer a few suggestions.
First, understand that you are going to need more cash. A PPL alone will probably take a good chunk out of what already have saved. That being said, with the weather getting better and you having the funding you should be able to start now and be flying by yourself by the summer if you are dedicated and don't screw around.
The question always comes up, school or club? I think you get a better bang for your buck with an established club. You could look at Evergreen Flying Club out of Renton, or Valley Fliers out of Auburn. I have worked with both of them and they are good, well established groups with a robust CFI base of folks who know the area well.
Schools. Anything established at BFI is going to be expensive. So, I would avoid. You can look at Alternate Air if you want, but be sure the equipment is solid. I haven't worked with them in years.
Renton has three schools: Pro-Flight, Rainier, and BEFA. Personally, I would go with Rainier to start. They have newer, albeit slightly more expensive equipment but they seem a little more 21st-Century geared.
15k should be enough to get you through a 141 ASEL IFR Program. After that, you are going to pretty much be on your own to get the required time to move to commercial.
Like I said before, don't screw around. The spring / summer flying season is here. Fly as much as you can during the week and don't scrimp on ground lessons.
Don't finance. Do you hear me? DO NOT FINANCE. Do not beat yourself into debt for an industry that isn't paying a livable wage for what you had to do to get into it. Work like hell, save up, and pay cash. That way, when you have all the ratings and no debt, it won't matter what you are making.
No one cares what your time is in. Fly the hell out of a cheap 150 or 152 to build total time.
04-04-2014, 06:02 AM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: Volleyball Player
Posts: 3,982
Originally Posted by Roger Mexico
The other choice for me, besides just saving up to pay for it out of pocket (could take years)
04-04-2014, 07:23 AM
#4
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Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 41
Chinook has some great advice. Stay away from BFI as the traffic will waste your money. Don't finance. There are plenty of outlying airports that have good FBO's. I'll put my 2 cents in for KPAE.
I attended BBCC and they have a great program. When I went through, they expected about 1/3 of the starting class to go through the entirety of the program. (I think my class did much better than average) People drop out due to finances, lack of skill, they lose interest, switch to the MX side, and other personal issues. Might not be a bad idea to test the waters a bit at the local FBO to see if it is the right thing for you to do. If it is, do it whole-heartedly and don't give up.
Chances are in 10 years you will be doing something other than what you planned... Enjoy the adventure as opportunities pop up.
I attended BBCC and they have a great program. When I went through, they expected about 1/3 of the starting class to go through the entirety of the program. (I think my class did much better than average) People drop out due to finances, lack of skill, they lose interest, switch to the MX side, and other personal issues. Might not be a bad idea to test the waters a bit at the local FBO to see if it is the right thing for you to do. If it is, do it whole-heartedly and don't give up.
Chances are in 10 years you will be doing something other than what you planned... Enjoy the adventure as opportunities pop up.
04-04-2014, 02:55 PM
#5
Tie Domi of Open Time
Joined APC: Oct 2011
Position: Whistles go woo
Posts: 65
I re-read your post and had to start from scratch. DOH!
Since you almost have your four-year, an UND or ERAU option would be a terrible idea. Big Bend might be okay, but you'd have to do additional classes to make full time student status. They have rules about the flight program and credit load. Great, great program though.
I would really finish your four year and make sure you are not filled with debt from it. If you got out of school with no debt, awesome. Work your butt off for a year, stock away money, heck go back and live with mom and dad. Get your commercial, multi and CFI all done locally, while working too. You'll have to be dedicated to do this. CFI on the weekends and during the summer, and continue to work. DO NOT go in debt to do this.
This may take a few years to do, but in the end you'll be ahead of the game, and actually, hopefully, have a decent job to support you as you do your flight training.
The schools at BFI charge a ton. Look into smaller options around PAE, RNT, maybe out at Crest or Thun Field, etc. Be smart with your money.
Since you almost have your four-year, an UND or ERAU option would be a terrible idea. Big Bend might be okay, but you'd have to do additional classes to make full time student status. They have rules about the flight program and credit load. Great, great program though.
I would really finish your four year and make sure you are not filled with debt from it. If you got out of school with no debt, awesome. Work your butt off for a year, stock away money, heck go back and live with mom and dad. Get your commercial, multi and CFI all done locally, while working too. You'll have to be dedicated to do this. CFI on the weekends and during the summer, and continue to work. DO NOT go in debt to do this.
This may take a few years to do, but in the end you'll be ahead of the game, and actually, hopefully, have a decent job to support you as you do your flight training.
The schools at BFI charge a ton. Look into smaller options around PAE, RNT, maybe out at Crest or Thun Field, etc. Be smart with your money.
Last edited by flyingice; 04-04-2014 at 03:03 PM. Reason: Edit for additional info
04-05-2014, 12:08 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Position: 141 IFR Student
Posts: 114
Just a suggestion. Join the military. I cannot speak to the Airforce, Marines, Navy, or Coast Guard. I am active duty, just about to retire.
A minimum of three years in the Army will earn you the GI bill. That will pay for your training (IFR/MEL/CPL/CFI/CFII/MEI) at a 141 school or if you'd like to go back to college for an Associates degree in aviation, the GI Bill will pay for that too. Save your money, don't go into debt.
With a Bachelors, you can join the Army as a Specialist (E-4), or as an officer. The difference will be how much time the Army will want from you. As an enlisted Soldier you can get a contract for 3 years, helping you meet your goal. As an officer you'll probably be commissioned as a 2LT and you might have to give the Army 6 years. You can also join the Army throught the "Highschool to Flight School" program if it still exists. You can recieve a direct commision to WO-1 if you can pass the fight test and are otherwise qualified. Again, if this program exists.
As for the other services, I cannot speak for them as I am not familiar with their programs and recruiting policies.
Here is a link to the Post 911 GI Bill:
http://www.benefits.va.gov/gibill/do...3_pamphlet.pdf
Good Luck
A minimum of three years in the Army will earn you the GI bill. That will pay for your training (IFR/MEL/CPL/CFI/CFII/MEI) at a 141 school or if you'd like to go back to college for an Associates degree in aviation, the GI Bill will pay for that too. Save your money, don't go into debt.
With a Bachelors, you can join the Army as a Specialist (E-4), or as an officer. The difference will be how much time the Army will want from you. As an enlisted Soldier you can get a contract for 3 years, helping you meet your goal. As an officer you'll probably be commissioned as a 2LT and you might have to give the Army 6 years. You can also join the Army throught the "Highschool to Flight School" program if it still exists. You can recieve a direct commision to WO-1 if you can pass the fight test and are otherwise qualified. Again, if this program exists.
As for the other services, I cannot speak for them as I am not familiar with their programs and recruiting policies.
Here is a link to the Post 911 GI Bill:
http://www.benefits.va.gov/gibill/do...3_pamphlet.pdf
Good Luck
04-05-2014, 05:46 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: Captain CL-65
Posts: 268
Hello there! I was in the same boat as you only two years ago... It was the summer after my freshman (and then I did it the next summer of sophomore year) of college where I was in seattle doing an internship for Boeing! I went to BFI almost everyday after work and flew with Alternate Air... It was a great experience and I never had a problem with an airplane other than maybe encountering one of the planes down for maintenance and I just took another one. I flew about 66 hours and got my PPL after completing my checkride over at Tacoma Narrows... I recommend them because I am a prime example of the fact it can be done in less than $6,000 because I certainly did it! Now I am graduating college debt free and will be getting my instrument and commercial back home (I live in NC) starting in August with ATP... They just put an operation in Seattle, look into that if your interested because it is a reputable fast track program although it is expensive you get a lot of different accompaniments such as higher multi time etc.. but to keep it cheap for right now highly suggest an independent CFI for the highly motivated individual. Good Luck and PM me if you have further questions about my experience up there at BFI etc.
04-05-2014, 11:24 PM
#8
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Joined APC: Dec 2013
Posts: 89
I am from the seattle area. Learned to fly at auburn flight (now closed) then purchased a share at a flying club called valley flyers. i did my instrument there for around 3500. I then did my commercial there and at crest (S36). Did my multi at Shebles in arizona for 2500 bucks. Dont go into debt.....no loans!....take the extra time. I paid for every rating out of pocket. Took me 2 years to go from private to single commercial. I then flew for fun....at 500 hours i got my first job flying single pilot 135 in bush alaska.......did that for 2 years till i got hired with a 121 regional. I went from pvt pilot to a jet in 5 years.
04-05-2014, 11:29 PM
#9
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Joined APC: Dec 2013
Posts: 89
Oh...btw....stay the F away from alternate air (scare) i was a member there at one point.....piece of junk planes. I had engines sputter, instruments fail, starters not work and had to hand prop several times. I also had popping and crackling noises at night with the panel lights on. I would invest the extra into good quality planes at a place like Rainer or pro flight...or even BEFA.
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