Revenue indicators: Percent of Empty Legs
03-06-2019, 04:26 PM
#1
XOJET Citation X
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: DO, Baker Aviation, Citation X
Posts: 316
Revenue indicators: Percent of Empty Legs
A question for the Fractional gurus on hear:
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
03-07-2019, 02:37 AM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 249
Originally Posted by chase
A question for the Fractional gurus on hear:
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
03-07-2019, 02:44 AM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 5,906
Originally Posted by Gundriver64
Based off the nature of day to day operations I don't think it's something that can be succinctly controlled (empty legs).
03-07-2019, 06:35 AM
#4
Speed, Power, Accuracy
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: PIC
Posts: 1,699
Originally Posted by chase
A question for the Fractional gurus on hear:
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
1. Is an indicator of financial health for a 135 operation (fractional) the number of non-revenue flights ( I.e empty) that are flown versus revenue generators? Realizing the other part is the average length of those empty flights is critical, PBI To FLL is a lot different than DFW to CLE.
2. Any of those numbers known to APC posters on here?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
The actual numbers are occasionally shared with flight crew during recurrent. But I certainly won’t share those numbers and I doubt any others will since they are covered by non-disclosure agreements.
03-07-2019, 11:26 AM
#5
weekends off? Nope...
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,940
Depending on the quote and price paid, the empty leg could also generate revenue. When a passenger goes to hawaii for 2 weeks, the empty legs back to the mainland and back to hawaii 2 weeks later is built into the total price of the trip. Or they pay a daily minimum if they want the airplane to sit out there and wait...
03-15-2019, 03:26 AM
#6
"Yinzer an'at"
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Position: Sittin at the puter
Posts: 186
There was a study done by KPMG in 2008. The 26 page report surmises that the problems in the Fractional industry have to do with pricing models more than strictly operational factors. I say surmises in that none of the big Fractional operators, NetJets, Flexjet, are publicly held so they don't report detailed financials.
The report is very interesting and it shows the revenue problems with the Fractional aircraft service model. It is worth reading.
https://www.irmi.com/docs/default-so...p.pdf?sfvrsn=4
The report is very interesting and it shows the revenue problems with the Fractional aircraft service model. It is worth reading.
https://www.irmi.com/docs/default-so...p.pdf?sfvrsn=4
03-16-2019, 06:06 AM
#7
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Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: PIC
Posts: 1,699
Originally Posted by Allegheny
There was a study done by KPMG in 2008. The 26 page report surmises that the problems in the Fractional industry have to do with pricing models more than strictly operational factors. I say surmises in that none of the big Fractional operators, NetJets, Flexjet, are publicly held so they don't report detailed financials.
The report is very interesting and it shows the revenue problems with the Fractional aircraft service model. It is worth reading.
https://www.irmi.com/docs/default-so...p.pdf?sfvrsn=4
The report is very interesting and it shows the revenue problems with the Fractional aircraft service model. It is worth reading.
https://www.irmi.com/docs/default-so...p.pdf?sfvrsn=4
I’m no NetJets cheerleader but that report was written a long time ago. NetJets has been consistently profitable for much of the last decade. Although the report lists some interesting factors that will always affect the business model, overall its assumptions and conclusions are woefully outdated.
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