Hey XO and Falcon,

You guys seem to be a good voice of XOJET here on this forum and you are the best source of information regarding the company. Unfortunately, XOJET recently became just another company (compared to Best of the Bay Area to work for..) when it committed the atrocity of the 23 terminations around Christmas time. Obviously, through no fault of you guys..

Also, you guys seem to be bearing the brunt of many of your fellow pilots' ire when you make postings here regarding XOJET. That is because many here know those pilots (aviation is a small world) or have been in a similar situation themselves before. So when you paint a rosy picture about the company, even when true, it is tainted by the Company's outrageous behavior with regard to the 23 terminations. You and all pilots know that there is no way that 23% (or whatever the percentage) was deemed substandard all the same day. To gloss over this or to minimize these atrocities only serves to anger your fellow pilots. I am not advocating that you criticize your company here on this forum..: After all, you are at-will employees working for a company that just destroyed 23 of your fellow pilot's careers. Rather, I ask that you try to understand the ire that your fellow pilots have regarding these career-damaging terminations vs. furloughs (Good luck finding a flying job in this or any market in the age of online applications with selective canidate filtering; Felony, Misdemeanor, DWI, Accident, Incident, Violation, No 4 Year Degree, No 2 year Degree, etc. They might never get a chance to explain to a real HR person as to why they were fired and that XOJET had no industry standard furlough policy because they already filtered them).

Finally, to use the terms "laid off", "let go", etc. diminishes the truly ugly way that XOJET treated these pilots. Bad companies and dictatorships commit atrocities: Good companies terminate for "cause" here and there and offer Military Leaves, Voluntary Leaves, Early Retirement, Reduced Hours, and Furlough with Recall Rights when the need arises. It is generally assumed that this is a company's honorable way of doing business, just as giving a company a two week notice is an employee's honorable way of doing business. Referring to these terminations as "furloughs", "lay offs", "downsizing", or "letting people go", can be likened to referring to the Holocaust as the Final Solution... It sounds better, doesn't it? But it was still an atrocity.

So don't take it personally when fellow pilots here are hard on you you because you work at XOJET.. I don't think that it is personal, just vented anger at another company treating it's employees like 5h1tt. After all, you guys survived there to fly another day. Good luck to you guys, your 23 terminated pilots, and all of us in the aviation industry during desperate times. Good luck to XOJET, too, but not to those that "pulled the trigger" of that atrocity. Karma for them, because they forever tarnished the reputation of XOJET as a great place to work. Hopefully, the wheel of justice will prevail with them. Good luck, guys..

In Unity,

B727DRVR

 

The only ATROCITY (slightly overused, think thesaurus) here is the fact that you just compared twenty-three pilots that lost/were fired/were furloughed from their jobs, whatever you want to call it and as unfortunate as it may be, to the Holocaust where millions of innocent people lost their LIVES. You, sir, have a seriously skewed vision of the world and are in need of professional help to put things into proper perspective.

 

G400driver,

Maybe you need to look up the word... In any case, here it is:

A-TROC-I-TY:
noun, plural -ties. 1.the quality or state of being atrocious.2.an atrocious act, thing, or circumstance.

I see no contradiction or misuse of this word in this circumstance. However, you seem more upset with my analogies than XOJET's atocious behavior! If, however, I offended your sensibilities with this comparison, I humbly apologize.

By the way, they were not "let go" and that was the point of my post! They were terminated with no warning! It doesn't sound if this has ever happened to you or anyone you know. I hope that your luck holds out.... And you are in the minority on these forums: Most of your fellow pilots here were apalled by XOJET's behaviour.. Not you though! I'm shocked that you condone their behavior though....

In Unity,

B727DRVR

 

I think he was referring to the word "HOL-O-CAUST" so you know... (And I don't think he meant he approved what XO did)

I don't think XO or myself were sticking up for the way the terminations were done. I think he was just saying that the people who found other jobs when recalls start, and don't want to come back, "choose not to"...

Were not proud of the way things happened, but it won't change anything. I actually hope that if "layoffs" happen again that it would be in seniority order, and I'm at the bottom of the list. I don't think they will happen, but that's how I feel, just for the record. Hopefully there will be some kind of recall policy as well (if it happens).

I wish the last group had recall rights that were public knowledge, but I hear rumors all the time that they are going to call people back.

It sucks to everyone that was involved. Period. Don't need to keep bringing it up...

 

Sorry, but I'm not going to fall for it.

Though you should read again what I said about your comparison of this situation to the Holocaust as that has been the only thing in this thread with which I've had ANY contention. Shameful.

 

I don't take it personally. However what I do take personally is your thinly veiled exploitation of our 23 fired pilots. These were coworkers and friends of mine, so I certainly don't need a lecture from you on how they have been affected. I believe you are simply promoting your personal agenda.

I'd like to offer you a little advise. Things are rarely so black and white. Instead, most things are varying shades of gray. You have decided XOJET is now a bad company based on half the information regarding one single incident. I'm not minimizing the impact these firings had on some very good and talented people. What I am saying is that you don't have the whole story, and one misdeed does not define an entire company. I can say with complete confidence that you tend to exaggerate just a bit.

I can also say that those responsible for deciding who and how to reduce our staffing level did not take the task lightly. They did not want to see anyone go, and no one felt worse about it than they did. Not even you. Now I don't agree with the method they chose either, but that doesn't mean the company sucks. Our leaders don't always make the right decisions, but they do try, and they usually end up doing the right thing in the end. This event and policy has for now diminished our company, but it is certainly not representative of how we are usually treated.

In any case, I am thankful to have such a good job especially in these difficult times. If you don't choose to take my word for it, it really doesn't matter to me. I like it here, my coworkers like it here, and we have thousands of applications on file from qualified pilots who would love to be here.

 

Gee guys, maybe you could all get over yourselves. The guy was pointing out how pilots were terminated without notice. Sure, he could have said it a different way, but let's not lose sight of what his point was. I think it is true that you can tell a lot about an organization by how they fire people. Citationshares handled it in a VASTLY different way. Don't kill the messenger for what he says because we are all entitled to our opinions. Sometimes the truth hurts.

 

Wow Guys....

And thanks for your understanding what I was trying to say, Bill.

I never intended to turn this into a flamebait post battle, nor was I trying to impugn you guys personally. I simply saw you guys being challenged by several of your fellow pilots on these boards, and it didn't seem you really understood the outrage here. I also don't think you realize that I want XOJET (and any American company for that matter) to succeed and have nothing personal against the company (Never applied, interviewed, rejected, etc.). I have several friends at XOJET who love their jobs, are well paid, love their equiptment, etc. XOJET employs many Americans, not just pilots, during today's tough economy. So I truly wish XOJET no ill will as a company: In fact, I hope that they grow, prosper, and hire many more of the aviation professionals currently on the street.. or about to be.

So I really don't "have a dog in this fight", not even being in the same part of the airline business, other than the fact that when I see fellow pilots, Americans, human beings, etc. getting screwed over I get Pi553d off. As to XO's assertion that I am somehow "exploiting?!" XO's terminated pilots, well.. I most respectfully disagree: I am one of the pilots that has stood up most vocally for these 23 since day 1. In fact, I feel that I have spoken up for them more than even their fellow XOJET pilots. Input sound of crickets chirping until lately... Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong..

As far as my agenda goes, well... You've got me there. It is easy to see my agenda on these forums by reading my posts: I am usually an advocate for the furloughed, the terminated, the powerless, and the downtrodden fellow pilots on these boards. Yes, I have spoken out against the XOJET and Flight Options terminations, as well as praised FlexJet and Citation Shares for the classy way that they have handled their downturn. I have spoken up for Virgin America pilots, Skybus pilots, Gemini pilots, and ABX/Astar pilots to name a few. When I thought a few of the "winning" pilots were gloating over the "losing" pilots, it pi553d me off and I called them on it. Do I get emotional and verbose when I see a wrong? Maybe..

And as far as exageration, I will admit to that if you all admit to your use of EUPHEMISM in your description of terminations there... A euphemism is a substitution of an agreeable or less offensive expression in place of one that may offend or suggest something unpleasant to the listener, or in the case of doublespeak, to make it less troublesome for the speaker. XO, you used a euphemism when you referred to your 23 fellow pilots as being "let go" and I think that you unknowingly served to dilute the severity of your company's actions. Being "let go" brings to mind a handshake, a hug, a tear, a severance check, a letter of recomendation, recall rights, etc. Far from the terrible reality of what your friends and fellow crewmembers experienced! Could I have said it in another way, or used a less painful analogy than the Holocaust? Sure, I admit to that, apologized to that, and will do that again freely. I probably should have used a less painful analogy than the Holocaust, like calling the current economic disaster a "natural correction" vs. "the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression", but I didn't. I did want to call you guys on your use of euphemisms, though. I did and I stand by it.

I can learn from all you guys, XO, Falcon, G400, Bill L, Fred F, etc. and I will take your gladly advise into consideration, XO. But also consider my advice on the use of euphemisms to dilute what I think was a very malevolent act by your company. To call it something less than what it was, I feel, only serves to let it happen again. That was my point.


As I said in my previous post, I wish you, XOJET, and your 23 terminated fellow friends and pilots well. And I am glad that you are proud and protective of your company. It is good to have a good career during these tough times. And I hope that XOJET follows the lead of Flight Options and recalls these pilots with back pay.. Flight Options made a mistake, but fixed it and XOJET can too. I don't think that these hopes are part of any veiled agenda... But if you believe that it is, then there is nothing that I can say that will change your mind. I feel that I have said my peace here and have again spoken up for pilots that found themselves in a similar situation like I did in a former life. I don't want this to conjure flame, use names, or require a Moderators scrutiny.

Best of luck and good fortune to you guys, XOJET, and their 23.

In Unity,

B727DRVR

 

Agreed. The point I was making was these termination's were handled in a manner completely out of character. I know the reasons why they handled things the way they did. All I will say is that I believe they tried to do what they thought was best for the entire group. In my opinion, and apparently yours, they miscalculated.

 

B727DVR,

I have no fight with you. I just ask that you try not to generalize so much and try to take more of a macro view. No one is defending the the way our folks were terminated. (jeez, I almost said let go) I don't believe it's fair to label an entire company based on one single event no matter how distasteful you find it. However, you are certainly entitled to your opinion.