Fractional v. Airlines?
08-14-2014, 11:44 AM
#41
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: A320
Posts: 321
Originally Posted by NoSidNoStar
Thank you CGT.
My understanding is that you guys also can sell back to the company about 120hr/year of PTO at 150% value of the current pay. I would dare to estimate that is the equivalent if another 15% income.
And nobody is evening mentioning the travel benefits, which are hard to use as a family, but I would personally looking forward to.
My understanding is that you guys also can sell back to the company about 120hr/year of PTO at 150% value of the current pay. I would dare to estimate that is the equivalent if another 15% income.
And nobody is evening mentioning the travel benefits, which are hard to use as a family, but I would personally looking forward to.
08-14-2014, 02:12 PM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,728
Originally Posted by NoSidNoStar
I am most interested to hear your opinion about his topic:
Would you go back to an average GA job now?
Would you go back to an average GA job now?
But as BoilerUP said in another thread - that kind of job is a very hard nut to crack, and when you're a middling 135 guy trying to get there, but not knowing when or if it'll happen, you start to peek over the fence a little bit. I went off to a national carrier, and once I got a taste of having time off that was mine (not "keep your phone on in case you need to scramble to find a contract guy to cover you" kind of off), it was really hard to look back. A few years later, the QOL trajectory at my national job started to spook me, and I made what's hopefully my last jump to Airways. I'll let you know if any of these decisions were worth a crap once I retire.
The fractionals were always interesting to me. Home basing and the genuine time off were alluring, but I didn't have competitive mins back when I got my first 135 gig, and by the time I did, everyone was furloughing. I have one buddy flying left seat of a 550 for NJI, and he's trying to get out and do the 121 thing, which surprises me. I think he's just tired of sitting around FBOs all day, but to start over seems like a big move.
08-14-2014, 02:54 PM
#43
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 473
Originally Posted by biigD
I wouldn't go back for any GA job now, let alone an average one. That said, if I already had a rockstar GA job - some Fortune 100 company with a large flight department and multiple crews per airframe - I probably wouldn't leave there to start at the bottom at an airline either.
But as BoilerUP said in another thread - that kind of job is a very hard nut to crack, and when you're a middling 135 guy trying to get there, but not knowing when or if it'll happen, you start to peek over the fence a little bit. I went off to a national carrier, and once I got a taste of having time off that was mine (not "keep your phone on in case you need to scramble to find a contract guy to cover you" kind of off), it was really hard to look back. A few years later, the QOL trajectory at my national job started to spook me, and I made what's hopefully my last jump to Airways. I'll let you know if any of these decisions were worth a crap once I retire.
The fractionals were always interesting to me. Home basing and the genuine time off were alluring, but I didn't have competitive mins back when I got my first 135 gig, and by the time I did, everyone was furloughing. I have one buddy flying left seat of a 550 for NJI, and he's trying to get out and do the 121 thing, which surprises me. I think he's just tired of sitting around FBOs all day, but to start over seems like a big move.
But as BoilerUP said in another thread - that kind of job is a very hard nut to crack, and when you're a middling 135 guy trying to get there, but not knowing when or if it'll happen, you start to peek over the fence a little bit. I went off to a national carrier, and once I got a taste of having time off that was mine (not "keep your phone on in case you need to scramble to find a contract guy to cover you" kind of off), it was really hard to look back. A few years later, the QOL trajectory at my national job started to spook me, and I made what's hopefully my last jump to Airways. I'll let you know if any of these decisions were worth a crap once I retire.
The fractionals were always interesting to me. Home basing and the genuine time off were alluring, but I didn't have competitive mins back when I got my first 135 gig, and by the time I did, everyone was furloughing. I have one buddy flying left seat of a 550 for NJI, and he's trying to get out and do the 121 thing, which surprises me. I think he's just tired of sitting around FBOs all day, but to start over seems like a big move.
08-14-2014, 02:57 PM
#44
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 473
Originally Posted by cgtpilot
That is correct. The only problem with our system is it caps your PTO bank at around 300 hrs per year. And you can only sell back if you have over 100 hrs in your bank. It does indeed payout at 150% of your base rate. Around $280 per hour for A320 CA.
Thank you for the intervention. :-)
08-15-2014, 06:40 AM
#45
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 650
I fly ISR in the Sandbox so we have a huge cross section of pilots from all walks of life. This is what I see here
-part 91 guys like myself and corporate guys here building Turbine PIC and banking cash so that when we get the call we can live on FO pay. None of us are even thinking about going back to where we were. Most of us are hoping with 2-3K TPIC that we can avoid the regionals. Only time will tell if that works. Before anyone chimes in that we will all be unemployed with the drawdown please do your research before looking like a fool. ISR is growing not shrinking.
-At least on NETJETS guy that is here waiting. Looks like he is getting recalled soon and is going back. He has the time and contacts that I am sure he could have went to at least an LCC but is waiting to go back to NETJETS
-two guys that quit Jet Blue to come here. Granted one was first year and one was second but they came here for the money and schedule. It is hard to beat walking in the door and making $110K or more the day you start for 180 days of work. They said that yes in the long run they would have made more at the airline but they had kids in school and couldn't live on the lower initial pay.
-at least three guys are bypassing recall to the majors until the last available time. They are making more money here while their seniority number is still clicking away at the major. Sort of the best of both worlds if you ask me.
Again I don't have a dog in the fight so I am just relaying what I personally see.
-part 91 guys like myself and corporate guys here building Turbine PIC and banking cash so that when we get the call we can live on FO pay. None of us are even thinking about going back to where we were. Most of us are hoping with 2-3K TPIC that we can avoid the regionals. Only time will tell if that works. Before anyone chimes in that we will all be unemployed with the drawdown please do your research before looking like a fool. ISR is growing not shrinking.
-At least on NETJETS guy that is here waiting. Looks like he is getting recalled soon and is going back. He has the time and contacts that I am sure he could have went to at least an LCC but is waiting to go back to NETJETS
-two guys that quit Jet Blue to come here. Granted one was first year and one was second but they came here for the money and schedule. It is hard to beat walking in the door and making $110K or more the day you start for 180 days of work. They said that yes in the long run they would have made more at the airline but they had kids in school and couldn't live on the lower initial pay.
-at least three guys are bypassing recall to the majors until the last available time. They are making more money here while their seniority number is still clicking away at the major. Sort of the best of both worlds if you ask me.
Again I don't have a dog in the fight so I am just relaying what I personally see.
08-15-2014, 07:40 AM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Baja Vermont
Posts: 5,177
The situation is nobody can guarantee that they will be a major wide-body captain in their last 10-15 years. Way, WAY too many life events, economy changes, bad day at the interview will determine one's career. Best to get as prepared as possible and take what comes.
Yes, a major career beginning at 26 on leading edge of a hiring/ retirement boom that actually happens is wonderful. But, I know dozens of guys whose parents are responsible for them starting out at a oil shortage, economy bust, deregulation who never even had a chance.
GF
Yes, a major career beginning at 26 on leading edge of a hiring/ retirement boom that actually happens is wonderful. But, I know dozens of guys whose parents are responsible for them starting out at a oil shortage, economy bust, deregulation who never even had a chance.
GF
08-15-2014, 11:57 AM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 473
Originally Posted by galaxy flyer
The situation is nobody can guarantee that they will be a major wide-body captain in their last 10-15 years. Way, WAY too many life events, economy changes, bad day at the interview will determine one's career. Best to get as prepared as possible and take what comes.
Yes, a major career beginning at 26 on leading edge of a hiring/ retirement boom that actually happens is wonderful. But, I know dozens of guys whose parents are responsible for them starting out at a oil shortage, economy bust, deregulation who never even had a chance.
GF
Yes, a major career beginning at 26 on leading edge of a hiring/ retirement boom that actually happens is wonderful. But, I know dozens of guys whose parents are responsible for them starting out at a oil shortage, economy bust, deregulation who never even had a chance.
GF
08-15-2014, 12:02 PM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 473
Originally Posted by Duksrule
I fly ISR in the Sandbox so we have a huge cross section of pilots from all walks of life. This is what I see here
-part 91 guys like myself and corporate guys here building Turbine PIC and banking cash so that when we get the call we can live on FO pay. None of us are even thinking about going back to where we were. Most of us are hoping with 2-3K TPIC that we can avoid the regionals. Only time will tell if that works. Before anyone chimes in that we will all be unemployed with the drawdown please do your research before looking like a fool. ISR is growing not shrinking.
-At least on NETJETS guy that is here waiting. Looks like he is getting recalled soon and is going back. He has the time and contacts that I am sure he could have went to at least an LCC but is waiting to go back to NETJETS
-two guys that quit Jet Blue to come here. Granted one was first year and one was second but they came here for the money and schedule. It is hard to beat walking in the door and making $110K or more the day you start for 180 days of work. They said that yes in the long run they would have made more at the airline but they had kids in school and couldn't live on the lower initial pay.
-at least three guys are bypassing recall to the majors until the last available time. They are making more money here while their seniority number is still clicking away at the major. Sort of the best of both worlds if you ask me.
Again I don't have a dog in the fight so I am just relaying what I personally see.
-part 91 guys like myself and corporate guys here building Turbine PIC and banking cash so that when we get the call we can live on FO pay. None of us are even thinking about going back to where we were. Most of us are hoping with 2-3K TPIC that we can avoid the regionals. Only time will tell if that works. Before anyone chimes in that we will all be unemployed with the drawdown please do your research before looking like a fool. ISR is growing not shrinking.
-At least on NETJETS guy that is here waiting. Looks like he is getting recalled soon and is going back. He has the time and contacts that I am sure he could have went to at least an LCC but is waiting to go back to NETJETS
-two guys that quit Jet Blue to come here. Granted one was first year and one was second but they came here for the money and schedule. It is hard to beat walking in the door and making $110K or more the day you start for 180 days of work. They said that yes in the long run they would have made more at the airline but they had kids in school and couldn't live on the lower initial pay.
-at least three guys are bypassing recall to the majors until the last available time. They are making more money here while their seniority number is still clicking away at the major. Sort of the best of both worlds if you ask me.
Again I don't have a dog in the fight so I am just relaying what I personally see.
Same goes for the NetJets guy. It is really amazing.
08-15-2014, 02:51 PM
#49
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 650
^^^ While I agree with you and even have an app in at Jet Blue I completely understand where they are coming from. $110K is base first year and a few companies pay even more. Compared to $49 and hour for a JB FO. Yes of course you can play the system and make more at JB but the same is true here. Want to make an extra couple grand? extend a few days on your 60 day rotation. Plus we get yearly raises like the rest of the world. Normally 3-8% depending on where you work.
08-15-2014, 03:55 PM
#50
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 473
I hear you. The first year pay cut could be brutal, and that is why is important for the youngsters to get it done and over with ASAP, while bills are small and life is simpler. At my age, I got to close my eyes, and take a big leap of faith.
I think it will be worth it in QOL (subjective) and long term earnings (objective).
I think it will be worth it in QOL (subjective) and long term earnings (objective).
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Past V1
Regional
61
01-22-2009 07:17 AM
