Safety becon
09-23-2018, 04:04 PM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 123
F##k this place. Only a few more months to go and I'm out. Thank goodness. They've ruined the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. We could have truly been a magnificent ULCC. With the codeshares and possibly buying some 330 NEOs, we could have taken over the world. But this management group has flushed that all down the toilet to the point of no return.
09-23-2018, 06:18 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2015
Posts: 180
Originally Posted by InThisTogether
F##k this place. Only a few more months to go and I'm out. Thank goodness. They've ruined the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. We could have truly been a magnificent ULCC. With the codeshares and possibly buying some 330 NEOs, we could have taken over the world. But this management group has flushed that all down the toilet to the point of no return.
Hate to break it down like this, but here it goes.
A magnificent ULCC and possibly buying some 330NEOs, whose a$$ did you pull that out of?? Come on man, lets talk facts and reality and I'd beg you to show me a magnificent ULCC, it's an oxymoron.
First of all, this isn't the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. This is however, like many places most of us have worked, a pilot group that's unified, has a lot of good camaraderie and composed of a lot of cool cats that are easy to spend time with when on the road. Southwest, United, JetBlue, American, Spirit and Alaska (note the omitted) all have amazing pilot groups, just like us. I personally love to laugh when a member of our illustrious management team tries to ingratiate us by saying that we're the best in the industry. Really?? Fu&* off. Actions speak louder than words and your actions specifically tell us how you feel about and respect us as a pilot group.
Second, and as much as I hate to say this, Indigo has done amazing things as the private equity owners of Frontier. They've done exponentially more than they ever set out to do. If you had been fortunate enough to invest $1000 with them at the beginning of this venture, do you have any idea what it would be worth right now?? Does Indigo give a flying F about us as pilots?? Hell no, but it's not there job to care about pilots, f/attendants, mechanics, or any other labor group. Their job is to make money for the investors. And they've performed at an unprecedented level. Call it a ship on a rising tide or whatever you want and they've done this despite a pi$$ poor management team, but you must differentiate between the two.
Do you feel wronged for this unfortunate reality?? Obviously you and many others do and for that there is no apology. You (and I and we) chose to solidify our roles in society as labor and as labor, this is the realm in which we must live. It would have been nice if the Han Solo flying the MF dream came to fruition, damn you George Lucas!!
Unfortunately, that which happened 5-10-15 years ago doesn't matter any longer. All that matters is today, tomorrow and the next. Anyone that would like to beat their drum on a high-horse and talk about the yesteryears and why we deserve what we deserve is delusional. Yes, I understand LOA67 yada yada yada, but even that was loosely written and is something for which we must fight, and ALPA is doing just that. But still, it's a future .
I say all this because there is too much emotion on this board and on the line for what we feel we are entitled to. The simple fact is that we are in a major fight, not a battle, but a war. We wage this war for what we NOW deserve in this marketplace. The pattern is clear and supports what we strive to achieve.
So how do we win this war? Simple I think. Stay engaged, don't propagate the rumor mill, fly the contract, protect yourself on the line, and self-police your fellow pilots. Make sure they're doing the same as you, and if they're not, ask them why and encourage them to get on board.
Simple economics dictate that we'll get a contract and one that we'll be proud of. The company simply can't execute their plan without one. No one buys their bull$hit Brad Lambert rhetoric "click the mic and lets talk" cutesy pootsey recruiting strategy. It's obvious based upon their desperation, THEY ARE STRUGGLING and we can use that to our favor.
So let's stop giving in and put a stop to the bellyaching, poor us, management keeps fu&*'ing us pilots, impotent mental propaganda. Let's own who we are and where we are and move this thing to the next level. We have the leverage and we are in charge of our own destinies. Defeatist mentality will get us nowhere, so let's flush it now.
Btw...Chewy would have been an awesome F/O.
09-23-2018, 07:00 PM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 453
Originally Posted by motorboatin
Hate to break it down like this, but here it goes.
A magnificent ULCC and possibly buying some 330NEOs, whose a$$ did you pull that out of?? Come on man, lets talk facts and reality and I'd beg you to show me a magnificent ULCC, it's an oxymoron.
First of all, this isn't the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. This is however, like many places most of us have worked, a pilot group that's unified, has a lot of good camaraderie and composed of a lot of cool cats that are easy to spend time with when on the road. Southwest, United, JetBlue, American, Spirit and Alaska (note the omitted) all have amazing pilot groups, just like us. I personally love to laugh when a member of our illustrious management team tries to ingratiate us by saying that we're the best in the industry. Really?? Fu&* off. Actions speak louder than words and your actions specifically tell us how you feel about and respect us as a pilot group.
Second, and as much as I hate to say this, Indigo has done amazing things as the private equity owners of Frontier. They've done exponentially more than they ever set out to do. If you had been fortunate enough to invest $1000 with them at the beginning of this venture, do you have any idea what it would be worth right now?? Does Indigo give a flying F about us as pilots?? Hell no, but it's not there job to care about pilots, f/attendants, mechanics, or any other labor group. Their job is to make money for the investors. And they've performed at an unprecedented level. Call it a ship on a rising tide or whatever you want and they've done this despite a pi$$ poor management team, but you must differentiate between the two.
Do you feel wronged for this unfortunate reality?? Obviously you and many others do and for that there is no apology. You (and I and we) chose to solidify our roles in society as labor and as labor, this is the realm in which we must live. It would have been nice if the Han Solo flying the MF dream came to fruition, damn you George Lucas!!
Unfortunately, that which happened 5-10-15 years ago doesn't matter any longer. All that matters is today, tomorrow and the next. Anyone that would like to beat their drum on a high-horse and talk about the yesteryears and why we deserve what we deserve is delusional. Yes, I understand LOA67 yada yada yada, but even that was loosely written and is something for which we must fight, and ALPA is doing just that. But still, it's a future .
I say all this because there is too much emotion on this board and on the line for what we feel we are entitled to. The simple fact is that we are in a major fight, not a battle, but a war. We wage this war for what we NOW deserve in this marketplace. The pattern is clear and supports what we strive to achieve.
So how do we win this war? Simple I think. Stay engaged, don't propagate the rumor mill, fly the contract, protect yourself on the line, and self-police your fellow pilots. Make sure they're doing the same as you, and if they're not, ask them why and encourage them to get on board.
Simple economics dictate that we'll get a contract and one that we'll be proud of. The company simply can't execute their plan without one. No one buys their bull$hit Brad Lambert rhetoric "click the mic and lets talk" cutesy pootsey recruiting strategy. It's obvious based upon their desperation, THEY ARE STRUGGLING and we can use that to our favor.
So let's stop giving in and put a stop to the bellyaching, poor us, management keeps fu&*'ing us pilots, impotent mental propaganda. Let's own who we are and where we are and move this thing to the next level. We have the leverage and we are in charge of our own destinies. Defeatist mentality will get us nowhere, so let's flush it now.
Btw...Chewy would have been an awesome F/O.
A magnificent ULCC and possibly buying some 330NEOs, whose a$$ did you pull that out of?? Come on man, lets talk facts and reality and I'd beg you to show me a magnificent ULCC, it's an oxymoron.
First of all, this isn't the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. This is however, like many places most of us have worked, a pilot group that's unified, has a lot of good camaraderie and composed of a lot of cool cats that are easy to spend time with when on the road. Southwest, United, JetBlue, American, Spirit and Alaska (note the omitted) all have amazing pilot groups, just like us. I personally love to laugh when a member of our illustrious management team tries to ingratiate us by saying that we're the best in the industry. Really?? Fu&* off. Actions speak louder than words and your actions specifically tell us how you feel about and respect us as a pilot group.
Second, and as much as I hate to say this, Indigo has done amazing things as the private equity owners of Frontier. They've done exponentially more than they ever set out to do. If you had been fortunate enough to invest $1000 with them at the beginning of this venture, do you have any idea what it would be worth right now?? Does Indigo give a flying F about us as pilots?? Hell no, but it's not there job to care about pilots, f/attendants, mechanics, or any other labor group. Their job is to make money for the investors. And they've performed at an unprecedented level. Call it a ship on a rising tide or whatever you want and they've done this despite a pi$$ poor management team, but you must differentiate between the two.
Do you feel wronged for this unfortunate reality?? Obviously you and many others do and for that there is no apology. You (and I and we) chose to solidify our roles in society as labor and as labor, this is the realm in which we must live. It would have been nice if the Han Solo flying the MF dream came to fruition, damn you George Lucas!!
Unfortunately, that which happened 5-10-15 years ago doesn't matter any longer. All that matters is today, tomorrow and the next. Anyone that would like to beat their drum on a high-horse and talk about the yesteryears and why we deserve what we deserve is delusional. Yes, I understand LOA67 yada yada yada, but even that was loosely written and is something for which we must fight, and ALPA is doing just that. But still, it's a future .
I say all this because there is too much emotion on this board and on the line for what we feel we are entitled to. The simple fact is that we are in a major fight, not a battle, but a war. We wage this war for what we NOW deserve in this marketplace. The pattern is clear and supports what we strive to achieve.
So how do we win this war? Simple I think. Stay engaged, don't propagate the rumor mill, fly the contract, protect yourself on the line, and self-police your fellow pilots. Make sure they're doing the same as you, and if they're not, ask them why and encourage them to get on board.
Simple economics dictate that we'll get a contract and one that we'll be proud of. The company simply can't execute their plan without one. No one buys their bull$hit Brad Lambert rhetoric "click the mic and lets talk" cutesy pootsey recruiting strategy. It's obvious based upon their desperation, THEY ARE STRUGGLING and we can use that to our favor.
So let's stop giving in and put a stop to the bellyaching, poor us, management keeps fu&*'ing us pilots, impotent mental propaganda. Let's own who we are and where we are and move this thing to the next level. We have the leverage and we are in charge of our own destinies. Defeatist mentality will get us nowhere, so let's flush it now.
Btw...Chewy would have been an awesome F/O.
09-23-2018, 07:50 PM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2017
Posts: 465
Originally Posted by motorboatin
First of all, this isn't the best pilot group anyone has ever seen. This is however, like many places most of us have worked, a pilot group that's unified
This group is pathetic, we still have guys doing single engine taxi for the heyzeus sake. Then there are others that think because they don't SE taxi that helping the company out in other ways is somehow justified. Seriously, if 1/4 of this group would wake up and pull their head out of the sand we might stand a chance.
09-24-2018, 07:28 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Posts: 497
Originally Posted by Gary et al
This group is pathetic, we still have guys doing single engine taxi for the heyzeus sake. Then there are others that think because they don't SE taxi that helping the company out in other ways is somehow justified. Seriously, if 1/4 of this group would wake up and pull their head out of the sand we might stand a chance.
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