"transform" operations to emulate Ryan Air.
12-03-2023, 10:15 AM
#101
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2022
Position: A320 FO
Posts: 295
Originally Posted by hercretired
it is not just "hotel room costs"
It is no-longer-needed limo/shuttle van contracts, etc stuff. Barry does not want to pay pilots, or pay anything or anyone else, unless they are actively making money for the company.
Barry has already come out and publicly stated on investor calls (read: SEC jurisdiction for senior officer statements) that a European model / day turn model is early 2024.
They absolutely will do day turns, I am sure in 1 year they can "re-evaluate" and the bean counters, CFO, can adjust the settings and pull other levers on the machine as needed.
Right now, it is day turns.
If they loose more money doing it, fine.
Until then....Everybody learn how to sleep in main cabin
It is no-longer-needed limo/shuttle van contracts, etc stuff. Barry does not want to pay pilots, or pay anything or anyone else, unless they are actively making money for the company.
Barry has already come out and publicly stated on investor calls (read: SEC jurisdiction for senior officer statements) that a European model / day turn model is early 2024.
They absolutely will do day turns, I am sure in 1 year they can "re-evaluate" and the bean counters, CFO, can adjust the settings and pull other levers on the machine as needed.
Right now, it is day turns.
If they loose more money doing it, fine.
Until then....Everybody learn how to sleep in main cabin
12-03-2023, 10:35 AM
#102
Last To Know First To Go
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 605
[QUOTE=Aero1900;3730932]
Yeah. Definitely. Going to a more heavily concentrated day turn based airline is not going to result in many if any pairings that have long deadhead. The math on saving money does a quick 180 when you pay a crew 5 hours to do nothing productive. A hotel room is cheaper. So we just won't see that often if at all.
The "going mostly to day turns" will only be where it makes sense. It's not like the company can't and won't build overnight trips. This discussion has kind of lost its connection to reality.
I wouldn’t refer to this plan as turns. I would call this day trips. We will leave base and fly to 2 to 3 different cities then end up where we started.
Also the company is already experimenting with what I would call double turns with same crew.
Originally Posted by ULLI
Yeah. Definitely. Going to a more heavily concentrated day turn based airline is not going to result in many if any pairings that have long deadhead. The math on saving money does a quick 180 when you pay a crew 5 hours to do nothing productive. A hotel room is cheaper. So we just won't see that often if at all.
The "going mostly to day turns" will only be where it makes sense. It's not like the company can't and won't build overnight trips. This discussion has kind of lost its connection to reality.
Also the company is already experimenting with what I would call double turns with same crew.
12-03-2023, 10:37 AM
#103
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by FlyingR6
BL is saying that we'll be 90%+ turns and 2 or 3 of our 12 bases will have a small amount of multiple day trips. One of my buddy's was literally just in ground school. It's real.
12-03-2023, 12:27 PM
#104
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2022
Position: A320 FO
Posts: 295
Originally Posted by hercretired
it is not just "hotel room costs"
It is no-longer-needed limo/shuttle van contracts, etc stuff. Barry does not want to pay pilots, or pay anything or anyone else, unless they are actively making money for the company.
Barry has already come out and publicly stated on investor calls (read: SEC jurisdiction for senior officer statements) that a European model / day turn model is early 2024.
They absolutely will do day turns, I am sure in 1 year they can "re-evaluate" and the bean counters, CFO, can adjust the settings and pull other levers on the machine as needed.
Right now, it is day turns.
If they loose more money doing it, fine.
Until then....Everybody learn how to sleep in main cabin
It is no-longer-needed limo/shuttle van contracts, etc stuff. Barry does not want to pay pilots, or pay anything or anyone else, unless they are actively making money for the company.
Barry has already come out and publicly stated on investor calls (read: SEC jurisdiction for senior officer statements) that a European model / day turn model is early 2024.
They absolutely will do day turns, I am sure in 1 year they can "re-evaluate" and the bean counters, CFO, can adjust the settings and pull other levers on the machine as needed.
Right now, it is day turns.
If they loose more money doing it, fine.
Until then....Everybody learn how to sleep in main cabin
You are literally doubling the operational cost of staffing the airplane with pilots and you are taking two pilots out of circulation that could be doing something else. Wouldn't we need a lot more pilots to support this type of deadhead flying? For every transcon we need double the pilots and double the pay.
12-03-2023, 12:37 PM
#105
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 300
Originally Posted by Dragonslayer69
I don't understand the cost savings of paying two captains and two FO's to operate a flight where normally it took just a single captain and FO.
You are literally doubling the operational cost of staffing the airplane with pilots and you are taking two pilots out of circulation that could be doing something else. Wouldn't we need a lot more pilots to support this type of deadhead flying? For every transcon we need double the pilots and double the pay.
You are literally doubling the operational cost of staffing the airplane with pilots and you are taking two pilots out of circulation that could be doing something else. Wouldn't we need a lot more pilots to support this type of deadhead flying? For every transcon we need double the pilots and double the pay.
12-03-2023, 03:19 PM
#108
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 319
Originally Posted by JoeFever1
Yea cause everything that dude says is true. They will either have to DH crews or they won't be doing any east coast to past the Rockies because it's impossible. Even just FL to DEN is tight and will fail a good chunk of the time.
12-03-2023, 03:34 PM
#109
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2018
Posts: 37
Originally Posted by Blueskies67
They have said many times over “mostly day turns” there will still be multi day trips but certain bases will have more and the smaller bases like CLE with have a higher percentage of turns. I don’t know why people are having a hard time grasping this concept.
12-03-2023, 03:54 PM
#110
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Blueskies67
They have said many times over “mostly day turns” there will still be multi day trips but certain bases will have more and the smaller bases like CLE with have a higher percentage of turns. I don’t know why people are having a hard time grasping this concept.
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