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-   -   Changing the Beard Rule (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/hangar-talk/100685-changing-beard-rule.html)

esa17 02-17-2022 03:19 PM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3373884)
If it takes a beard to make you look more mature, you're quite possibly one of those who adds "and a half" when stating your age.

Every time I hear someone say, "at the regionals..." it reminds me of kids who describe back in the day, when they were in kindergarten.

There does come a point when one needn't make an effort to look more mature; one simply is more mature, and doesn't need to advertise that.

If we have pilots in cockpits who need a beard to look mature enough to fly the airplane, perhaps we simply need more mature pilots.

When I was 30, I looked 16, and was straight up denied flying jobs because of how young I looked.

No matter how “mature” I acted, it still looked like I was there on a “take your son to work” day.

I couldn’t have grown a beard then but made up for that later.

TransWorld 02-17-2022 08:47 PM


Originally Posted by esa17 (Post 3374245)
When I was 30, I looked 16, and was straight up denied flying jobs because of how young I looked.

No matter how “mature” I acted, it still looked like I was there on a “take your son to work” day.

I couldn’t have grown a beard then but made up for that later.

Would you have thought the same of a man bun or long and scraggly hair down to your shoulders. Both can be perceived negatively by some of the flying public.

dera 02-17-2022 10:03 PM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3373884)
If it takes a beard to make you look more mature, you're quite possibly one of those who adds "and a half" when stating your age.

Every time I hear someone say, "at the regionals..." it reminds me of kids who describe back in the day, when they were in kindergarten.

There does come a point when one needn't make an effort to look more mature; one simply is more mature, and doesn't need to advertise that.

If we have pilots in cockpits who need a beard to look mature enough to fly the airplane, perhaps we simply need more mature pilots.

Since when has this been relevant?
Beards these days are a fashion style, nothing to do with maturity or trying to look mature. You might agree or not agree with it, but there is no harm in allowing them.

Happy to have a beard. As a middle-aged man.

JohnBurke 02-17-2022 11:41 PM


Originally Posted by dera (Post 3374411)
Since when has this been relevant?

Since the poster whom I quoted, and to whom I replied, brought it up.

Read.

bajthejino 02-18-2022 12:23 AM


Originally Posted by JohnBurke (Post 3374414)
Since the poster whom I quoted, and to whom I replied, brought it up.

Read.

Pattern detected, the man talking of maturity, who then acts as if he has none.

sailingfun 02-18-2022 03:15 AM


Originally Posted by Wags808 (Post 2325876)
Perhaps as an agnostic/atheist it is my strict belief to grow my facial hair however the hell I want? :D

It really is a "minor" thing overall, which is why I think it just never gets pushed too hard. If there is a consensus the rule is dumb and should be changed I think we could do it.

Why are you writing to ALPA. You should be taking this up with your airlines management.

galaxy flyer 02-18-2022 07:05 AM

Okay, what’s the attraction of looking like you’re auctioning for a ZZ Top tribute band or a a Civil Ear re-enactment? Or looking like an imam?

rickair7777 02-18-2022 07:27 AM


Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 3374450)
Why are you writing to ALPA. You should be taking this up with your airlines management.

If management perceives a want, they'll happily charge the pilot group some negotiating capital for the privilege since it costs them nothing. Changing the status quo is not free in RLA land.

Assuming management assesses that bearded pilots won't harm their brand image... some folks over age 50 or 60 associate most facial hair with dope-smoking bohemians, and it turns out those are the people with time and money to travel.

So yes, your union is the place to start, they'll have to trade something with management which means a significant % of the pilot group will need to be cool with that.

Some companies might do it unilaterally if they think it would help them recruit & retain pilots.

tnkrdrvr 02-18-2022 07:46 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3374577)
If management perceives a want, they'll happily charge the pilot group some negotiating capital for the privilege since it costs them nothing. Changing the status quo is not free in RLA land.

Assuming management assesses that bearded pilots won't harm their brand image... some folks over age 50 or 60 associate most facial hair with dope-smoking bohemians, and it turns out those are the people with time and money to travel.

So yes, your union is the place to start, they'll have to trade something with management which means a significant % of the pilot group will need to be cool with that.

Some companies might do it unilaterally if they think it would help them recruit & retain pilots.

The authorization to wear beards at UPS happened without any IPA involvement. Basically, corporate HQ determined that attempting to enforce grooming standards across a workforce of 500,000 people was costing more than it was worth. The pilot group was simply lumped in with everyone else. The only standard left is that a UPS employee must wear the uniform to work that matches the gender they identify as that day.

Is this good? Time will tell.

I’m skeptical, but people also aren’t as picky about the appearance of the pilots who fly their boxes around. We aren’t customer facing and don’t have to deal with all that entails.

SonicFlyer 02-18-2022 09:23 AM

Also allowing facial hair might help attract younger pilots.


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