Yep, you can lead a horse to water only so many times..

While firing BL is a huge step forward, they are in for a surprise if they think anything is going to change by that alone. Firing brad isn't going to make Q400 classes some how full again. There needs to be a significant change in management and their philosophy of running things..

My advice to them: You might have more success if your director of flight ops and VP of flight ops IS ACTUALLY A PILOT. Someone who knows what it's like to fly the line. There's WAY too many people in director level positions of power at this airline who have never flown a fking plane before. Look at any successful airlines history and the people who have ran the flight ops departments have always been line pilots at some point.

I vote PS for Director of Ops(note 1). You know who. Seriously, they don't need someone who is a good solider and cuts deep when they want to squeeze more juice out of us for the sake of profits. They need an effective leader that can cut through Bull. PS is the only possible candidate I can think of, although I know there are other great candidates within. Perhaps they'll scalp talent fro outside.

Either way, They airline is failing at it's only job. Move stuff from A to B. That isn't hard.

Note 1: Yes, I know it's not a democracy.

More to your point, it's isn't the pilot's responsibility to properly manage, staff, and lead a company. The point at which a company's labor pool is more tallented at running a company than the management is, there is a serious problem. Pilots are a unique kind of unionized work force. Are there any other kinds of heavy machine operators that are generally, well educated in both business and the machine they operate? I can't think of any.

The VP of flight ops who we just fired flew an airbus once 10 years ago when he snaked his way up the ladder at virgin. He did their inaugural flight to SFO or something.

In the years he was at Qx he never flew the Q400, never completed training, yet made policy decisions that affect us significantly. We're the only airline in the US that still flies Q400s and it's arguably one of the most difficult and challenging planes to learn to fly...He's responsible for trying to get our AQP cycle cut from 3 days to 2 which was a huge pita for all us who had to be guinea pigs (Feds said no after trial was done). He's also responsible for having upgrade training slashed..q400 upgrades will now have to do 30 hours of CBT, 3 days of ground, then oral checkride and off to the sims. The 2 week ground school is gone. "That's how we did it on the Airbus!"

The FOs upgrading now will be able to handle it but the 175 FOs down the road will struggle big time.

I always espoused that. Why? Because:

1. QX pilots are trained to the same standard as AS pilots. Sit on a jumpseat and the departure/approach briefings are mirror images.
2. You know the work ethic of the QX pilot. You have his personnel file.
3. You know how he/she fits in with the corporate culture of your airline group.

But every time I suggested it to someone on the 2nd floor it was scoffed at. "We want to be able to hire people from differing backgrounds." Answer: Then just flow a percentage of the pilots you need from QX. No sale.

Bring it up to QX managers like the Bagwan and his direct response: "I don't want to be the training center for Alaska pilots." In the mean time the QX pilots that wanted to work for AS and would have been perfect fits were bailing out for SWA, UAL, etc.

Angle Lake "thinking" can be very mysterious.

Good discussion. I used to work for an airline who's management philosophy was to not give employees the resources they needed to do their jobs, then scream loudly at them and threaten bankruptcy if they failed. They are gone now.

Muddle through the summer then ditch half the Q's, replace them one for one with 175's and you might make it.

It's been well know for 20+ years. If you want to fly for Alaska, dont go to QX...

You hit the nail on the head. Regional pilots have proven time and time again that career progression is #1. Not pay or QOL. After all, it's a race to mainline!

Even with the recent pay increases at many regionals, it is still peanuts compared to what the other half gets. American in genius to have propped up their slave labor groups the way they have. People are tripping over themselves to go work for those 3 sh!tee wholly owned airlines.

AAG survives off the fact that people from the PNW will take serious concessions to work for Alaska. Now that word is out that working for Horizon could hurt your chances at getting to Alaska, it severely hurts your recruiting. A simple flow is all that's needed.

PS. I hate flows as they are a management tool to perpetuate this crazy contractor system, but the reality is that it works.

I question 12/2014 junior Ejet captain. Where are you seeing this? Im senior to that and cant hold the Ejet.

Check the August flica award and scroll wayyy down near the mfr dash upgrades. He's there.

Have you been a dash captain for less than a year? If yes you're seat locked

PS is the best candidate hands down but it wouldn't work, he's the type of person who will straight up tell them what they need to do to fix everything and they would look at him and say "no." So he would walk. Can't say enough good things about PS though, a pilots pilot and a real standup guy.

I've flown with him maybe two times tops while on reserve and let me tell you, no matter how many months goes by that guy still remembers my name and shakes my hand before I get to even addressing his name first. Seriously one of the most stand up guys here and I would vote him in as well. Come on PS!!!!!!!

I'm sure mgmt would love PS to bail them out too and preach their baseless slogans yet, I believe that he scares them because the man has integrity that's real and isn't just a slogan. PS can't be bought and he isn't the greed mongor that those at the top of the pyramid scheme are. The perfect storm is total cop out they have been told over and over this was coming for years by so many even a few in the mgmt ranks yet they treated this place as their personal ATM machine and left the employees scraps and now they actually have to lead and they are clueless. The "Thanks for all your do" slogan needs to change with "We are going to do what needs to be done" period.

If it's a flow what advantage does having a pilots work record give Alaska?

Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall.....

Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall | The Seattle Times

Horizon already pays more than Skywest, plus Horizon has the 15-20k bonus when starting.

But the Skywest guys basically just voted in a large pay cut (1% per year increase for 4 years of a 5 year agreement which will be an 11% decrease after inflation) in exchange for a vague promise by the company to get more than 100 planes and to do a big chunk of the Alaska flying.

Why would guys go to Skywest for 30k less the first year than Horizon? After that I think Horizon pays 5k a year more.

I'm not saying that pay package is great, but money isn't everything ... and people sure don't get paid especially if your sittting on the ground...

That means Horizon cabin staff will have less work, which the company hopes to handle by offering unpaid leave and part-time work to employees who volunteer.

You, like many people who voted no, are mathematically challenged. Instead of simply dismissing the Pilot Profit Sharing, do the math. It nets out to about an additional 2-3% increase this year and 1-2% in the out years. All together, the new TA represented about an 8% increase in total compensation for me. But forget about pay rates, the real money is in soft time. Thus far this year I have already credited over 1000 hours on just over 500 block. You can't do that bashing out 8 legs a day for 4 hours of block.

He doesn't work at SKYW.

Yes he does. And his 8% raise numbers are similar to my calculations.

I'm not near 1000 hours of credit, but at a 2:1 credit-to-block ratio year-to-date nonetheless.

For us mathematically challenged, could you explain the pilot profit sharing and how one would calculate that into the pay calculations. I know there are a lot of special deals at SW for the senior guys and the guys in the SW training department. How many guys actually have the ability to credit 1000 hours in 7 months? If a pilot is sitting reserve what can he do? If a pilot has a 90 line what can he do? And can't the Horizon guys do similar things?

How much of the profit sharing goes to a guy who can only credit 900 to 1000 per year?

And I guess, overall, how come Horizon is in this mess when they seem to pay more? Are they just late in hiring?

I was talking to Jonneaux about the person he was quoting.

I think he meant me.

How does one do the 2:1 credit-to-block? Can everyone do that? I can see a training person get 75 hours of credit not flying and then go fly 65 hours for 75 more credit but can a line guy in DTW?

How do you derive the 8% result?

No. But i do. And i can contest that thats true if all you do is stanups. I would say 1300hrs a year credit is pretty easy if you live in base... (the PPS is capped at 1400hrs a year, meaning the standup or training guys that do more then that dont get more then the average pilot.. they do on the financial rewards. That a straight 3-7% of your pay every quarter depending on profit margins)

And yes the new TA it more then a 1% increase. I would say with bonuses ect. 5%. And 8% if you add in 401k. That was huge for me.. back on the Horizon topic looks as the AS 700's are closer to the hanger in TUS.. the ones going back to the leaser were in FAT. Wonder if they will bring them back to help out...

hey speaking of AS 737s.. When AS is sending them on Qx routes, are they flying half empty or did they cancel enough flights to get a decent load factor?

No, not everyone can do it, especially not new hires. Vacation, user time,, minimum daily guarantee, some standups and who knows what else. I'm just taking the numbers from the scheduling page, throw in training pay, 401k match and who knows what else. I broke into six figures by the begining of July.

You can't do that "bashing out 6 legs a day for 4:12 of credit" either!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

What can 1st year FO expect to make monthly gross once bidding line? Are there lots of soft/premium pay available? Can you make more or less weather on Q or Ejet?

Thanks

On the Q expect about 1k per check, plus per diem around 400-600.

There is premium pay at 150% but you won't want to pick any up.

The jet trips aren't very efficient right now because the full route structure is not there yet, by once they are you will definitely make more on the jet.

Just curious:

I see the Q400's in LAX. What cities are they flying too?

off the top of my head,

Medford, Mammoth/Yosemite, Gunnison, Santa rosa and maybe somewhere else?

Monterey...Medford is gone, Gunnison is seasonal.

I am ashamed in myself for not knowing this lol

And AAG has dropped MFR-LAX-MFR for a month (at least) while they try to stop the bleeding and stabilize the patient.
That is the most shortsighted decision I've seen them make in a very long time. That route is ALWAYS full.

(Oh, and BTW, Eagle and Allegiant have just started flying it. :rolleyes: )

Just as dumb as them dropping STS-LAS, those we're always full too.

Thanks guys.

Taining Hotel
 

Can someone please chime in on what hotel or hotels are used during Sim training? Thanks

sent pm

filler