Which Spirit Base Do You Want?
 

Oops
Filler

The question is: What new bases will B6 looking to create after expansion in ADDITION to the NK bases?

I’m thinking SLC.

I was thinking MYR….:D Which has more daily flights??

It’ll be less than 50 miles from ocean…

Great Salt Lake is salt water too…

But it is a piker compared to the Dead Sea…

I think SLC is very unlikely. I think SFO has a chance. Joanna has mentioned LAS growth and I heard her say potentially more PHX flying but not sure whether that meant a potential focus city. I don’t think anything else out west is likely until the Alaska merger.

LAS would be great.

Why SFO? It’s expensive to operate out of there and you have CA taxes as well as their labor laws. Besides, you already have LAX, for CA and NK has a large base in LAS. They are the second biggest carrier there after SWA.

Even PDX would be better - at least once they’ve finished their terminal expansion. You could cover NorCal flying from PDX fairly easily.

https://simpleflying.com/portland-in...-halfway-mark/

They like to have crew bases on both ends of Mint flights when possible to minimize delays/cancellations.

used to. Can’t do that anymore.

Seriously?

https://i.ibb.co/dLCvsmw/B91-FAF91-1...3-ABCD9131.jpg

What is your point?

SFO typically leads the west coast in weather related delays/cancellations.

He said, specifically, that JB likes to have a crew base at both ends of a Mint flight, to minimize delays/cancelations. In other words, to mitigate the effects of delays/cancellations on Mint flights. To recover from crew time-outs, crew sick calls. The fact that SFO has delays is a reason to have a crew base their, in case chit. JB runs Mint almost like a separate airline, with longer turn times and more breathing room in the schedule to try and keep the Mint lines running more on time, and more reliably.

Not saying they will open SFO, but SFO has a lot of Mint flights and is one of our most important routes. Mint is some of our most profitable flying. So, if the delays are substantial and frequent enough to cause flight cancellations, they could/might look at SFO as a small pilot base.

I like your idea of SLC, and think JB COULD do well there. But as of right now there are few flights, it is a fairly small station. So they would have pursue it aggressively to justify a base. Maybe they will someday, but I've never heard it mentioned in that way. Maybe the NK acquisition will cause them to rethink the way they base aircraft and crews? None of us know that yet.

SLC has VERY high levels of leisure travel in the winter and summer, and lots of business traffic. I do think we could do very well there, if JB could get a lot of gates.

Looks like 20 to 30% is the typical norm. Does not allow me to conclude anything at all.

Yet another reason to have reserves there…

Excapt the title of the graphic is airports in the US with the highest percentage of delayed and cancelled trips. So. Yeah, the seven worst…

Gates are going to be up for grabs, second half of A term is opening this year, B term next 18 months. Already got permission to add 8 additional gates and already talking about adding a C term. Someone is going to move in, just a matter of who, big D can’t hog them all.

I thought I heard Breeze wants an SLC hub? Honestly would love to see JB move in there heavy and hard. But I'd have to see it to believe it...

Currently Breeze is operating out of PVU about an hour south. But I think they want into SLC when gates become available

There's a whole part of the network where that isn't the case on Mint flying so no...

If you were a young junior FO would you leave for a legacy that you would have to always commute to or stay at JB and live in base if given the opportunity?

Depends on if you wanted to fly widebody. That probably isn’t going to happen at JB. But a YOUNG FO, particularly one living in base, will wind up with more than adequate toys and retirement, assuming they keep the number of exes they are paying alimony down to a reasonable level. But money is more important to some people than others. So is collecting exes…

Live in base no doubt. It’s a different job vs commuting.

ideally you’d get hired at a legacy and move to one of their junior bases though

Depends on the base and where you'd be happy living. I live in NY because the schedule flexibility and opportunity to earn extra is hard to ignore at this stage in my life, but it's difficult having to pick between living in a cramped, high cost of living city or commuting and watching your trip (and life) quality degrade.

If you live in base and have some seniority, IMO the 320 trip quality at JetBlue is comparatively better than my 737/320 friends at United at the same relative seniority (who also live in base), and they're mostly stuck with their schedules as it's far more difficult to drop and trade over there. The advantage for them, however, is they're living in a state that has 0 income tax and you can actually afford a home, unlike NYC. That's a significant advantage.

Hopefully we will have a better selection of bases that offer JFK flexibility in zero tax states like FL, NV, TX. My assessment of my friends at other carriers is pretty spot on with yours. I personally am hoping Dallas or South Florida for my future base. It will be nice to have options that the merger should provide.

I agree. I'm really happy at JetBlue; I'm about two years on property and have little trouble adjusting my schedule and picking the type of flying I like. I don't think I'll have quite that flexibility at a legacy, even in base, so I'm skeptical the grass is actually greener in that regard.

If we can expand our base footprint outside of the coastal cities, combined with improved QOL elements/pay in the JCBA, JetBlue could become quite unique (provided one isn't chasing a WB).

Good info. I'm on the Spirit side and considering staying or leaving for a legacy (I live in the NYC area already). The UA peeps I talk to say that UA is amazing and that I should come. The JB peeps say that JB is great and that I'm going to love it after the merge. I love riding on jetBlue. United is meh. I'm still mad at them for what they did to Xjet. I can do Euro flying and drive to work at either airline. The only thing making me feel like leaving is the "what if the merger fails or is otherwise a disaster?" thing.

Tell me the equipment you'd be flying with both airlines to Europe and the average pay/PS you'll get at each.

Don't care and a lot of money either way.

With that level of understanding, please go to UAL, or anywhere.

Lol. Exhibit #100.

Better than Mesa, right?!

He’ll fit right in 🙄

If you're willing to live in NYC, which he already does, he's not wrong. United will fly XLR's to Europe before not too long, and WB flying at UA is years of global reserve and isn't for everyone (although who knows how short that will become).

The issue with JB is you HAVE to live in NYC to unlock that level of flexibility and earning potential. The second you have to commute, I don't see any real advantage of staying at B6 over going to legacy. There's less metal to get to work and now you're bidding for commutable trips at an airline that has a significant % of commuters, so there goes your trip quality as you get stuck with the SDQ redeyes.

Our other bases are either way too senior to be feasible as a base (FLL/MCO) for someone relatively new, or they're too small and limited (EWR).

Spirit merger really needs to succeed in opening up the country for us.

Boston says hi.

Who? Is that a real thing?

Your friends at UA will outpace your seniority quickly at UA.
It will take about 20 years at B6 for half the current seniority list to retire. At UA that will happen in closer to 10. 20 years at UA and close to 70 percent of the current list will be retired.
With the 190 retirements I believe we'll see upgrade times increase due to the relative parity between the 320 and 220 fleets. This will likely add to a degradation in QOL for a large portion of our seniority list.

Not saying you are wrong but I don’t understand the math. Aren’t there aircraft on order to replace the 190s?

https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/p...its-firm-order

and another 70 or so 320 variants

Not to mention the ones NK has on order, 33 this year alone. Combined, they will be looking at a fleet of 675 aircraft by 2027.

https://airlinegeeks.com/2022/04/06/...-spirit-offer/

Granted, neither JB or NK have anything like the retirement lists of some of the legacies, but there is a lot of growth in those order books. Yeah, once they stop increasing the fleet size things will slow down to steady state, upgrades limited to retirements, but I don’t think that’s happening any time soon. Eventually, yeah maybe. Soon? That sure isn’t the plan.

Big pay difference = large seniority difference = faster upgrade on more junior equipment. Similar pay scales = similar upgrade = slower overall upgrade as the most junior plane is similar to the most senior plane (unlike when it has been a 20% pay diff).