jblumindtrick

Whatever happens, until we have more TRUE geographically spread pilot bases, quality of life for the vast majority of our pilots (who are mostly commuters) will continue to deteriorate.

Economies of scale dictate that fewer bases increase profit margins. It will be painful as we grow into our big shoes. Plain and simple.

I think that a lot of "wishful thinking" is causing many to feel disturbed because really nothing will happen until Darien says it will. For now, get ready to bid for the E-190 and/or Boston or not.

banger

Just curious, do you know that 85% of the pilots from LGB are commuters?

FNG320

Banger, I didn't that was the current situation. However, when LGB first opened up and had less crew members, that was not the case. In addition, those that chose to commute to LGB or to FLL knew that these bases were suppose to be set up for QOL and cost savings, not productivity. Yet, that seems to be what certain people want. Get the base started for any reason, then demand parity or better in productivity.

Just my opinion....

FNG

jetblue320

And what is wrong with parity? Seems to me that the LGB/FLL crews aren't "demanding" anything. It sure looks like it's the JFK crews (or at least in your opinion) that are getting screwed. Did you happen to notice that out of the 75 crews in FLL that alot of them are in the top 30% of their respective seat seniority? But then, we all need to be equal right? Please remember that before there were out bases, we ALL were JFK crews, some of us for 3+ years when the majority of the pilot staff was thumbing their noses at us from their comfortable seats in the cockpit of a USAir/UAL/DL/AAL (pick one) plane. Or, bashing us anonymously on Flightinfo.com or assorted other websites like that. Now, you have just transferred your anger and resentment to Airline Pilot Central.

What do you guys want? Do you want JB to be like those other outfits that you either left or got furloughed from?

Sure seems like it to me, but then, that's just my opinion, right?

Geeezzzz..............



Just MY opinion!!!!

FNG320

Problem is you don't seem to understand (can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink..... actually a U.S. Marine can, but lets not go there). The base (FLL) was opened under the quise for "quality of life" and that they would give up some productivity to get the QOL. Well, that didn't happen. Within 6 months, they/you got quality of life AND productivty at the expense of JFK. They may have some senioritgy there, but it was their choice to go to FLL for QOL not productivity, that was how the base was sold to the management. Then once they get there then it was time to raise the seniority flag. Thats BS... The stats from when FLL started speak for themselves. Then when you have the guy who builds the pairings living in FLL you are assured to get FLL to the top of the heap. Hey, that is the facts. If you can't stand the truth, turn off your computer and go away.

Hey, lets make it equal. Lets just bring all pilots back to JFK and you can bid with the whole group.

I just love it when the magic "SENIORITY" word gets involved. Seniority, Seniority, Seniority..... Seniority should be the difference between 15 days off and 18 days off, or 90 hours vs 82 hours, not 18 days with 90-95 hours vs 12-13 days with 70-75 hours. Check some of the lines that the JR bidders at all bases get, (Even FLL). Your seniority is on the backs of the poor JR bidders at FLL and most of the bidders at JFK (senior and junior). Everything you spout is more about "YOU" instead of what is best for the majority or even the company. I can tell you are a real team player. If you don't like it, then yell "SENIORITY" and wait for everyone to run in fear.

In my opinion, your opinion is not worth much. Some of us whant change to improve the QOL, benefits and pay for all of us. You are only interested in the QOL, benefits and pay for YOURSELF and your SENIORITY click at FLL. Hey, if you can't stand the truth, then again, turn off your computer...

And that my opinion.....

FNG

jblumindtrick

Whatever the issue may seem to be, I bet if we ALL had better base pay pilots wouldn't be starving, fighting and looking for shelter.

I don't mind non-optimal pairings, I don't mind being junior. I do mind not being able to pay the bills. When I fly the worst nonproductive trips with the least amount of time off and make $50k less it creates turmoil.

Our base pay is STILL quite low. If we can fix this fundamental problem the rest of the problems will not fester.

No matter what base you are senior enough to want to hold, you are underpaid. Especially if you expect to enter the New York or California economies.

Alaska just took a 26-30 percent pay cut. But still, look at their new rates.

I feel we are worth more. We contribute an intrinsic value which should not be diluted to that of just "crewmember".

Imagine the headlines stating JetBlue pilot group takes pay RAISES. It is not out of the question. If our business model runs off the fact that we make more money by paying pilots less then let's just cut to the chase. Let's take 95 percent pay cuts and just drive down CASM. Let's get CASM down to 5.5 cents.

jetblue320

Tell me again what I don't understand? I understand completely. I understand that your opinions are all that count and the rest of us (that started this company BTW) just have to suck it up and level the field.

Don't tell me that I am not a team player Pal, I started this team on first string. I think that you are just a bitter individual that thinks the world (and JB) owes you a living.

Have a nice day anyway, although I think I am too late telling you that. I am done conversing with you and the likes of you because I have better things to do with my time off. All 19 days of it!! Sorry to hear about your bad luck.

C yaaa

FNG320

It IS amazing how people react when confronted with the truth. Opinions, we all have them, and some of mine may suck to you, but at least have facts (I try to have them when I make a statement.). I am at least after fairness for both JR and SR pilots. I have nothing but thanks to those who make the decision to come to JB when all the majors were hiring and it had no jets, that was a gutsy move. But nowhere does it say that we owe you our eternal loyality and should bow down everytime you enter the room. We are suppose to be a "pilot group", but it is the few like you that fragment us into the us vs them (have vs have-not or the super-senior vs everyone else). Does JB owe me a living, no but they do owe all of us (me and you both) fair treatment and equality. I'm not bitter, but I am really disappointed that those with "SENIORITY" don't work harder to make it fair for everyone. It is just like some other post on this board and the premium pay issue (support the senior guys at the expense of the junion guys). It seems that if it helps you, then OK, but if it levels the playing field or you lose 1 hr of pay or 1 day off then it is no way. I know we don't have union, but if we did, you would be one of the guys who say "FULL PAY TILL THE LAST DAY, and PROTECT THE TOP 10% AT THE EXPENSE OF THE BOTTOM 50%".

Overall, I am just disappointed that we can't work together.

Just my opinion.....

FNG

Lennon

Another gem from the "I've got mine" crowd.

Meworry?

Hey, I thought this was the Staffing and QSO forum. When did it become the "Bash each other and air our dirty laundry for all the other airlines to see" forum? I'd like to give my opinion, but you guys are scaring me! Oh, OK, I'll give it anyway.

Pay raises: I don't think so, not until net earnings are up over a dollar a share and forecast to stay there. Then, base pay can go up and our options might actually be worth something. Profits first, then pay. The reverse has been tried at other airlines. SWA has great pay, but they make money at 67% load factors (thanks to fuel hedging) and we would all still be making FO pay if we had gone there when we were hired. I came here instead of SWA because I would make more money the first 10 years, and that is still true (for me, maybe not for new hires). Finally, our rapid growth had been fueled by sky-high debt, unlike SWA. We have to make money (read cash flow, real money, not paper) to service that debt, and therefore stay in business. Patience is a virtue.

Bases: Nothing wrong with small productivity differences, but no one agreed to "lower productivity" just to get a base. I was here, went to all the pocket sessions. QOL was a big factor, but bases had to make financial sense, and we "cannot call ourselves a nationwide airline" without a west coast base, so said Dave Barger. The number one factor in pairing construction is cost, followed by productivity and QOL. You commute to JFK, I commute to LGB, why should my productivity suffer to protect yours? However, I agree that artificially evening out productivity to within five minutes is unnecessary, especially if it is done by slamming the junior guys with unproductive trips while the senior guys enjoy 3 hours more average daily credit. 15-20 mnutes is, I believe, a reasonable window.

Thanks for listening!