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Old 07-01-2008, 05:05 AM
  #31  
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I emailed Barry Schiff recently to get a copy of an article her wrote for AOPA magazine a while back. He was gracious enough to respond with it and I think it merits a read by anyone wanting to go into flying.
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THE PROFICIENT PILOT
BY BARRY SCHIFF
FOR JUNE, 2006 ISSUE

I have been agonizing over the topic of this column for a few years not knowing if I should publicly air these personal thoughts. Not to do so, I finally concluded, would be intellectually dishonest. So at the risk of attracting flak, here goes.
I was hired as a pilot by Trans World Airlines in 1964. This was during the Glamour Years that began after World War II. Airline salaries were rising, working conditions improved with every contract renewal, and airline pilots earned approval and respect from every quarter. On international flights, airline pilots were treated like royalty.
No one working for Pan American World Airways or TWA during this period could possibly have anticipated the demise of their airlines. These were cultural icons of the 20th century. At one time, TWA’s logo was the second most recognizable in the world (Coca-Cola’s was the first).
The death knell for this era sounded on October 24, 1978 when President Jimmy Carter signed the Airline Deregulation Act. Without arguing the merits and demerits of deregulation, the long-term result for pilots was etched in stone. There would be an erosion of wages, working conditions, pensions, and job security.
Things got worse after 9/11. Because of the need for additional security, airline pilots are locked in their cockpits behind bulletproof doors and suffer the indignity of coordinating trips to the lavatory with flight attendants.
The Glory Years are gone.
I could not have been prouder when my son, Brian, was hired by TWA in 1989. Although conditions had declined since the airlines were deregulated, being an airline pilot was still a great job. He upgraded to captain on the Boeing 727 eleven years later. Although thrilled to be in the left seat of a jetliner for a major carrier, he worked harder and earned a smaller salary than I did many years previously.
TWA was assimilated by American Airlines in 2001. During the next 2 years Brian went from left seat to right seat to the street. He had been furloughed and eventually found a job flying Learjets for a Part 135 operator. He now flies as captain of a Canadair Regional Jet for a commuter carrier.
Like thousands of others who have been furloughed from the majors, he has no idea when he will be recalled. Considering that American is reducing its need for pilots by contractual increases in pilot productivity and outsourcing many of its shorter, thinner routes to commuter carriers, it could be many years before Brian again sees an American Airlines’ flight deck. Another son, Paul, began to satisfy his desire to become an airline pilot in 2000 when he was hired by Trans States Airline, a company that operated TWExpress, US Airways Express, and American Connection. Paul bounced between all three and discovered after 9/11 that he was not making headway in accruing seniority.
After four domicile changes, he opted to leave Trans States and obtain a more promising position with United Express. He worked there for 3 years during which he had as many changes in domicile and discovered that the most he had earned after 6 years as a commuter pilot was less than $30,000 per year. He again foresaw little potential for a career like I had and with great mental anguish opted to change professions.
Paul recently started a pet-supply company (www.wholesomepetsupplies.com), gets to spend every night in his own bed, and has an opportunity to develop a social life. As an airline pilot gone from home 21 days a month, he had little opportunity to meet someone with whom he might like to share a future. When he did meet someone, he had neither the time nor the money for dating.
Paul says that “it is relatively easy to get a job with a commuter carrier, but not because these carriers are losing pilots to the majors; they are not. The attrition rate at the regional level is high because so many pilots reach their limits of endurance and quit. They find it too difficult to live on starvation wages [especially those with families]. There usually is nothing left in my wallet after shelling out for commuting and crash-pad expenses.”
Although these are anecdotal experiences, my frank and personal discussions with numerous other airline pilots corroborate my feelings about the state of the airline industry. I can no longer encourage aspiring airline pilots without first ensuring that they understand the treacherous and daunting journeys typically required to reach for such lofty goals.
Do not misunderstand. Coping with the challenges of weather, communing with Nature in a way that only pilots can appreciate, and maneuvering a sophisticated aircraft from one place on Earth to another remains a stimulating and gratifying endeavor (although I think it was more fun with less automaton). It is the price one must pay to get there that is so discouraging.
I frequently am asked for advice about becoming an airline pilot. The best advice I can offer those determined to endure the rigorous hardships often required is to simultaneously develop a sideline vocation that can be used in case of emergency. A pilot should never get into a position that is totally dependent on income from an airline.
Does the end justify the means? Does becoming a captain for a major airline justify all that must be endured to get there? Perhaps, but surviving long enough to get there is the problem.
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Old 07-01-2008, 05:14 AM
  #32  
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Just food for thought.

I unluckily (or luckily depending on your perspective) was unable to follow the type of career I wanted in aviation because I couldn't get a medical.

Long story short I became a Licensed Reactor Operator at a commercial nuclear power plant, a la Homer Simpson.

After doing the shiftwork and all that goes with it for ten years, I gravitated out of the control room and into Project Controls. I've been doing that for about 18 years now.

Truth be told I haven't worked all that hard (shift work can be tough though) and have gotten to the point that I make about $250K per year contracting through my own company to power companies.

For someone in their early 20s to early 40s (there are no age restrictions I just don't think many, although I have known some, would want to start this career path later) going into Operations at a nuke plant might be a good career decision.

Requirements for getting in are not too tough. Namely squeaky clean background for at least five years and the ability to pass initial (and then random) drug screens.

To come directly into the operating department you will have to pass a test that's heavy, but not overly so, in math and display a good mechanical aptitude.

Most plants around the U.S. are union and have a starting wage in the low $20s/hr range. If you get hired, after a short time you'll be sent to a school for approx. one year learning about how power plants work. After successfully completing "primary" (different utilities call it different things) training you will get a raise to the high $20s/hr and go on shift until seniority gets you into license school. Impossible to estimate how long that will take but in some locations (Turkey Point in Florida comes to mind) it will be as soon as you're able to digest it. On the other hand, it's not uncommon for guys (there are girls too) to forego license school and work up to around $100K/yr without the hassle of getting/maintaining a license.

Once you get your license you can expect to make in the high $100s/yr if you want it. Think of the $100s in thirds, lows if you avoid OT at all costs, mids with moderate OT, and highs if you're willing to work whenever they want you.

Most plants work a six-week rotating 12-hour shift scheme. I once worked where out of each six week period I spent one week in training (requal) and had two seven-day breaks. The remaining time was spent between day and night shift.

There are a lot of Reagan era ATCs in this business and of course ex-navy nukes. I have known a couple of ex-military pilots (B-52 and F-4) that went a simiar route but they both had engineering degrees and went straight to the Senior Reactor Operator level which is non-union, but may or may not pay more money long term as long as they remain in the Operations Department.

Last edited by Airduds; 07-01-2008 at 06:08 AM.
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Old 07-01-2008, 01:44 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by SkyHigh View Post
There are plenty of ways to be bored and miserable. How's about poor and unemployed? There is a down side to not listening to others too. There is no logic in holding on to a loosing position.

Skyhigh
I agree. My point is more about acknowledging personal responsiblity for our choices. I can not blame the industry for my i'll prepared life set-up. It was a risk, I knew it was a risk, but I took it. I still want to see this career choice pan out, though.

To point of being bored and miserable:

Happiness is not something you do, its not something you get, its not even something you really "achieve." It something you ARE. You either are, or you are not. I reflect that I am not, and probably would not be no matter how much money or how many hot girls I could get.

There are plenty of people in this world that don't really have as many choices about their life as many of us do in America, and yet they can still be happy. Maybe it really all lays in attitude. I think FZ was trying to make a similar point. You just have to listen to yourself.
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Old 07-01-2008, 05:20 PM
  #34  
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Its nice to hear people talk about aviation in terms of enjoying the flying, but not just the other stuff that goes along with it. Its not all negative, just not the bed of roses it should be when your entrusted with the flying publics lives on a daily basis. I'm not going to talk negatively about the flying, just the industry as a whole needs to change. I will always light up with a smile when I think of some of the fun flying stuff I've seen, heard and done that goes on up front on the flightdeck with the unwitting public oblivious to that fact in the back

Nice to hear that aviators like Lifter, Lear and Nightsky all have either part or almost all of the same feelings/experiences I'm going through. And there are other options other than flying 121 as lear states.
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Old 07-01-2008, 07:04 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Rnav View Post
Its nice to hear people talk about aviation in terms of enjoying the flying, but not just the other stuff that goes along with it. Its not all negative, just not the bed of roses it should be when your entrusted with the flying publics lives on a daily basis. I'm not going to talk negatively about the flying, just the industry as a whole needs to change. I will always light up with a smile when I think of some of the fun flying stuff I've seen, heard and done that goes on up front on the flightdeck with the unwitting public oblivious to that fact in the back

Nice to hear that aviators like Lifter, Lear and Nightsky all have either part or almost all of the same feelings/experiences I'm going through. And there are other options other than flying 121 as lear states.
I think that everyone here loves flying. Its the things it can do to your life that causes the heartburn.

Skyhigh
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Old 07-02-2008, 05:37 PM
  #36  
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Skyhigh,

Yeah, it can cause heartburn. But you move on. I'm not going to dwell on how bad the hotels were, bad food and how long it took to get where I'm at. Granted I haven't been flying 121 as long as alot of the fellas/gals here, but I have done it and can say I will have very fond memories of the people I met. There is a positive in every negative in life. Just like I had to go through it myself, any newbie who reads our post should decide for themselves if it was worth it to them in the end no matter if they end up being a capt. at UPS or on the street without a job...

Some part of us will always be airline pilots deep down. No matter where we go career wise, we flew the line and we did it the best we could with what we were given(no rest, low pay and crap schedules). Thats what seperates us from others who just talk. Sometimes we run out of luck(a very important aspect of a successful airline career) and then we hopefully move on to greener pastures...
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Old 07-02-2008, 11:32 PM
  #37  
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Great article by Barry. It's true, it can be a great career, if you are lucky, if know the right people, if you time it just right, and if stay in good health. Lots of 'ifs' in there. The price you pay, and just being able to survive that long while trying to keep your relationships or families intact, finances on course, and somehow through all the ups and downs still save enough to retire may prove to much for some. Really - one of the biggest hang-ups I have is the lack of lateral movement options. Having to start all over at the bottom in case of job change due to moving on, furlough, bankruptcy etc, is just too painful a thought for me right now. And chances are I'll face it sometime soon. There are too many variables we cannot control in regards to our own success. So much random chance is involved. I cannot imagine what those United pilots to be furloughed must be going through right now, going back so far in seniority. Then I see the whole US Air East vs. West mess and it reinforces what a backwards, brutal industry it can be.

Airduds - thanks for the info. Wish they had a plant out in these parts.

In other news - my sister-in-law just graduated high school last month - and is now making more money than me, a third year regional FO nearly twice her age. "If I knew then what I know now."
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Old 07-03-2008, 06:07 AM
  #38  
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Default Dislocated Workers Unite !!

If anyone here is to become laid off and is considering a career change I highly advise you take full advantage of what the government has to offer. After 9-11 I got one year of unemployment insurance, free health insurance for my wife and children and offers to be retrained as a truck driver, short order cook and welder at the governments expense.

I took the 737 type because it was within driving distance. My first choice was to be retrained as an accountant however the local university would not cooperate with the program. The point is that as a newly laid off professional worker the powers that be are willing to do a lot for you.

Each state varies though. Do your research. Apply for stuff. Find out now what is offered before you get the ax. Have a fall back plan. Move if you have to. Sell stuff. Get ready. Make lists of jobs you could do and careers that you are interested in. Call friends and ask if you would be of service in their industries. Study different professions. Tour companies, trade schools and colleges. Consider starting a business while you are still working as a pilot. Think about refinancing your home. Read books on stuff that could facilitate your plan. Your could use this unfortunate situation as an advantage to transform your life.

Make a solid plan and you will feel stronger and have more confidence if the end comes. Get your family ready to act. Move past any ego issues you may have about government assistance and remember that you have paid a fortune in taxes and will continue to do so. The government is not shy about taking your money so when it is time you step up and get as much of it back as you can. The money is there for you to use when you need it.

Plan the work then work the plan.

SkyHigh

Last edited by SkyHigh; 07-03-2008 at 06:17 AM.
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Old 07-03-2008, 07:34 AM
  #39  
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Plan B is always there.

I am just lucky that I have a steady job that most here probably think is below "their means". Part 135 unscheduled freight.
I have been doing this since the early 90's, have no debts anymore, a very healthy 401(k) and a nice IRA, even though over the last year it's not looking as good as it once did . I am also a part-time bridge professional and Texas Longhorn breeder.

I made a decision many years ago to stay with 135 for many reason but the main one is that I wanted to be able to retire at 50. With 10 years to go I should be able to easily make that, then I will probably change things around and make full-time what is now part-time and vice-versa. I think the biggest thing is to figure out what you need to do for yourself, changes jobs many times over many years is probably not the way to go. You always start at the bottom again and then you'll be playing catch up for years to come.

In the mean time I'll be having fun golfing, playing bridge, raising cattle and hanging out with my family
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Old 07-03-2008, 07:37 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Learflyer View Post
Since i'm one of the people that opened his big mouth about this new forum getting started, I should tell you about me. I was at Raytheon Travel Air in it's hey day back in 2000. Then, they merged with Flight Options where I spent the next 6 years. The lifestyle was 8 days on, seven off. Sounds great and everything, but it drove me nuts personally. The 7 off was great, and could not be beat. On my 7th day off, i'd start getting ancy, and miserable around the house. To me, it was stressful having to throw a suitcase together and pack for an 8 day trip twice per month. I couldn't stand the TSA, today you take your shoes off, next week you don't have to kind of mentality or lack of standardization.

Hotels? No thanks. As "great" as NJA is, there has to be some guys that deep down inside feel the same way I did/do. "but we stay at the Ritz Carlton". Didn't matter to me. I couldn't stand the lifestyle of getting to the hotels and if your thirsty, you are afraid to drink the tap water out of the nasty bathroom sink. Either that, or have to spend at least 1.50 (3.00 in hpn) for a coke. Me, I like to go to my own fridge, and get something to drink. it's the little things like this I didn't like anymore. Don't forget trying to find a hotel restaraunt that will warm up your crew meal that you dragged across the country that your dying to eat. "sorry, we can't be responsible for food borne ilness" I kid you not.

The wx....couldn't stand TS's anymore. Call me a pu$$y, but i'm an alive pu$$y. To me, man made machines shouldn't be dodging mother nature like that. The statistics are there. Oh yeah, freezing rain sucks too!

The good.....In order to spare myself of being called militant, extremist, or negative, There are some things I miss about it. The 7 off is one. The other is the people I worked with were great professionals. I miss jogging in the park on San francisco bay one day, and the next running along the ocean in KACK. I miss the early morning departures where you take off with a quarter mile vis an 500 overcast and penetrate the clouds and now it's sunny.

I don't miss how bad my timing was in this industry. I still fly contract on occasion. I'm now a sim/ground instructor at a large part 142 facility. some of my days are only two hours long(sim week). some are only 8 hours long (ground week). Yet we are still small enough where were not working the graveyard shifts. i'm excited about getting my masters degree, and maybe pursuing law school like my wife did.

More to come!
Some pilots are better of as sim instructors and it makes the skies safer and FBO's more bearable for us
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