Doctor's Notes for Sick Use
05-13-2026 | 04:46 PM
#61
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 5,567
Likes: 229
From: UNA
25% of your FAE, tax free for up to 1 year per event or 2 years lifetime. Cost is .53% of your earnings
that APA plan sounds better.
05-13-2026 | 07:22 PM
#62
In a land of unicorns
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 102
From: Whale FO
Maybe you'll convince me otherwise, but here are some thoughts...
For one, it's free to me (or pre-negotiated, however you want to think of it).
For two, as I understand them, it generally comes with better terms. [At DL, disability [i]pays 50% of the highest 12 consecutive months in the last 36, with no offsets unless you exceed the 'original' 100% threshold (which is super unlikely/rare), and includes Profit Sharing and potential "retro" pay in the calculation. And, it continues to whatever the FAA mandated retirement is - so age 67 is already baked in (if it happens).] I had a buddy who had a huge year with the last contract's Retro pay and the following year's Profit Sharing being in the same 12 months. He actually got a pay raise on disability from what he had been making, lol. Not that it's typical, but still...
For (maybe) three, and I say this not actually knowing what other companies do... Being contractual and 'in house' at DL, we don't have an outside company* materially getting in the middle of it do deny or reduce benefits. Like how UHC makes health care a nightmare as a third party. *Harvey Watt does administer DL's disability program, but having used it twice, my experience was very simple and easy with them. They basically just validate your sickness, and send a 'thumbs up' back to the company - that's it.
For four, and I can't believe I'm saying this, but I trust DL to pay up more than I trust XYZ mutual to pay up. Or said another way, I trust XYZ less...
ALPA also has some optional disability insurances, which I do pay separately for, and came in very handy when I had a major event. But that's beyond the scope, I think?
Why do you think outside policy is better? Genuinely curious.
For one, it's free to me (or pre-negotiated, however you want to think of it).
For two, as I understand them, it generally comes with better terms. [At DL, disability [i]pays 50% of the highest 12 consecutive months in the last 36, with no offsets unless you exceed the 'original' 100% threshold (which is super unlikely/rare), and includes Profit Sharing and potential "retro" pay in the calculation. And, it continues to whatever the FAA mandated retirement is - so age 67 is already baked in (if it happens).] I had a buddy who had a huge year with the last contract's Retro pay and the following year's Profit Sharing being in the same 12 months. He actually got a pay raise on disability from what he had been making, lol. Not that it's typical, but still...
For (maybe) three, and I say this not actually knowing what other companies do... Being contractual and 'in house' at DL, we don't have an outside company* materially getting in the middle of it do deny or reduce benefits. Like how UHC makes health care a nightmare as a third party. *Harvey Watt does administer DL's disability program, but having used it twice, my experience was very simple and easy with them. They basically just validate your sickness, and send a 'thumbs up' back to the company - that's it.
For four, and I can't believe I'm saying this, but I trust DL to pay up more than I trust XYZ mutual to pay up. Or said another way, I trust XYZ less...
ALPA also has some optional disability insurances, which I do pay separately for, and came in very handy when I had a major event. But that's beyond the scope, I think?
Why do you think outside policy is better? Genuinely curious.
Legacy LTDs are very good but that's a function of their CBA, not who administers the plan or holds the policy.
These companies don't fight the clear "can't hold first class medical" disabilities at least in my experience. These claims are small for them and they are mostly reinsured anyway. As long as their loss rate is acceptable (and they know how to price these policies), they don't really seem to care.
The way it works for us is if you lose your medical, they pay 60% of your last W2 up to a cap of $10k a month until FAA retirement age. This payout is tax free assuming you impute your income for the benefit, we can also choose not to for a completely free LTD coverage, but then (as required by law) that payout is taxable.
This cap is obviously low, but is subject to negotiations. We got this plan outside Sec6.
Another (slight) concern is the moral hazard from the company's side. One example would be that United pilot who is suing for wrongful termination over a dispute about LTD. That hazard generally doesn't apply to TPA's.
I bet many Spirit pilots are happy their plan wasn't self insured. That scenario obviously is very unlikely with legacy airlines.
05-13-2026 | 07:38 PM
#63
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 538
Likes: 5
From: FO
Previous job in the dark decade;
We'd all been there long enough to have 3 weeks vacation with line bidding, so effectively, 17+ days off a month with a vacation "week". Sick call rules basically granted a pilot 2 four day trips without requiring a Dr's note. Do the math, every other month and one gets over half the month off with NO QUESTIONS ASKED.
Was funny, looking at the bid pack for sickation conflict, just like vacation conflict.
Nope, get sick at an outstation or commute, ya gotta get home somehow. Almost 3 decades of doing this, 20+ with CASS/15+ with KCM, NEVER heard a word about JS'ing/NR'ing to get home on a sick call.
Now, calling in sick, THEN NR'ing/JS'ing to a leisure/vacation is a TOTALLY different ball game, IF they check.
Sounds like AA sucks.......
We'd all been there long enough to have 3 weeks vacation with line bidding, so effectively, 17+ days off a month with a vacation "week". Sick call rules basically granted a pilot 2 four day trips without requiring a Dr's note. Do the math, every other month and one gets over half the month off with NO QUESTIONS ASKED.
Was funny, looking at the bid pack for sickation conflict, just like vacation conflict.
Nope, get sick at an outstation or commute, ya gotta get home somehow. Almost 3 decades of doing this, 20+ with CASS/15+ with KCM, NEVER heard a word about JS'ing/NR'ing to get home on a sick call.
Now, calling in sick, THEN NR'ing/JS'ing to a leisure/vacation is a TOTALLY different ball game, IF they check.
Sounds like AA sucks.......
The non-rev scenario; basically they say if you are to sick to operate, you're too sick to deadhead. But if you're banging out to not work? You probably wouldn't do it mid trip anyway. If I'm calling out mid trip, it's probably because I have the flu and can barely get out of the hotel bed. In which case, I'll ask them to extend my room...
05-14-2026 | 03:02 AM
#64
Moderator
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 8,337
Likes: 1,343
Tax free option is a federally mandated imputed income. It’s based on our November hourly pay rate (from the previous year, so especially beneficial to upgrading FOs), regardless of number of hours paid. So for the high earners and recent upgrades it’s a very good deal. I pay my marginal tax rate on ~$600/check for the tax free option. It’s the same every check, no matter the gross.
Detail on best of 5 previous calendar years (or previous 12 months, whichever is higher) is basically everything that earns pay. Excludes per diem (obviously). All the same things you mentioned including our second to none profit sharing, haha. Only (potential) downside is the 401k is paid as cash if you opt for the tax free option, because you have no taxable earnings to contribute to a 401k. But low tax rate brokerage cash is not the worst thing in our line of work, especially if you want to retire before 59.5.
Got ahead of myself with poor formatting. The $30k/mo would be including the 401k. I’ll edit for accuracy (nevermind, won’t let me edit).
Detail on best of 5 previous calendar years (or previous 12 months, whichever is higher) is basically everything that earns pay. Excludes per diem (obviously). All the same things you mentioned including our second to none profit sharing, haha. Only (potential) downside is the 401k is paid as cash if you opt for the tax free option, because you have no taxable earnings to contribute to a 401k. But low tax rate brokerage cash is not the worst thing in our line of work, especially if you want to retire before 59.5.
Got ahead of myself with poor formatting. The $30k/mo would be including the 401k. I’ll edit for accuracy (nevermind, won’t let me edit).
Our ALPA insurances vary, and there are several different ones (and several different 'levels' of payout on one). I take 2, one is a $50k lump sum, and the other is a monthly payout of $2400/mo (can go up to $6k/mo in $600 increments). Both are tax free payouts, and the premiums I pay for those 2 are about $100/month. It doesn't 'start' for a year, and goes to 5 years. It's really meant to bridge the gap after DPMA stops.
One other note about DPMA. 99.9% of DL pilots participate, and is an independent mutual aid entity. It's an awesome thing. While yes, it's 25% of your FAE, it's tax free and is really meant to fill what the "other half" of (our) taxable company benefit would be to make you "whole". Said another way, between the company LTD and DMPA, you effectively do not really lose any after-tax take home income for the first year after going on LTD. That's when the ALPA insurance kicks in to soften the 'stoppage' of DMPA if it goes that far. Hope that makes sense.
Sounds like at least AA and DL are ballpark similar, with some differences.
05-14-2026 | 04:33 AM
#65
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 365
Likes: 127
Having the option to pay tax on the imputed income would be a huge win, IMO. I think I'll start working on that for our next-next contract (the next contract has already started, and the 'asks' are set...) We also have 'free' (aka company paid) life insurance that is "2500x the highest Capt Rate", and currently amounts to ~$1.2M, but have to pay imputed income on the 'premium' which makes the payout tax free - so they are at least familiar with that concept. I get ~$132 of imputed income per paycheck for that.
Our ALPA insurances vary, and there are several different ones (and several different 'levels' of payout on one). I take 2, one is a $50k lump sum, and the other is a monthly payout of $2400/mo (can go up to $6k/mo in $600 increments). Both are tax free payouts, and the premiums I pay for those 2 are about $100/month. It doesn't 'start' for a year, and goes to 5 years. It's really meant to bridge the gap after DPMA stops.
One other note about DPMA. 99.9% of DL pilots participate, and is an independent mutual aid entity. It's an awesome thing. While yes, it's 25% of your FAE, it's tax free and is really meant to fill what the "other half" of (our) taxable company benefit would be to make you "whole". Said another way, between the company LTD and DMPA, you effectively do not really lose any after-tax take home income for the first year after going on LTD. That's when the ALPA insurance kicks in to soften the 'stoppage' of DMPA if it goes that far. Hope that makes sense.
Sounds like at least AA and DL are ballpark similar, with some differences.
Our ALPA insurances vary, and there are several different ones (and several different 'levels' of payout on one). I take 2, one is a $50k lump sum, and the other is a monthly payout of $2400/mo (can go up to $6k/mo in $600 increments). Both are tax free payouts, and the premiums I pay for those 2 are about $100/month. It doesn't 'start' for a year, and goes to 5 years. It's really meant to bridge the gap after DPMA stops.
One other note about DPMA. 99.9% of DL pilots participate, and is an independent mutual aid entity. It's an awesome thing. While yes, it's 25% of your FAE, it's tax free and is really meant to fill what the "other half" of (our) taxable company benefit would be to make you "whole". Said another way, between the company LTD and DMPA, you effectively do not really lose any after-tax take home income for the first year after going on LTD. That's when the ALPA insurance kicks in to soften the 'stoppage' of DMPA if it goes that far. Hope that makes sense.
Sounds like at least AA and DL are ballpark similar, with some differences.
Small point, but any insurance product you pay for (via premiums or imputed income) is “tax free.” That’s not an airline, union, or industry specific thing.
05-14-2026 | 06:20 AM
#66
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2018
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Likes: 256
05-14-2026 | 06:36 AM
#67
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Joined: Sep 2011
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Is that ~$16k maximum at UA taxable? And is that 'blended' rate based on your assigned fleet, or is the 'blend' across all fleets (such that every seat gets the same?)
05-14-2026 | 09:48 AM
#68
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2018
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Likes: 236
05-14-2026 | 04:45 PM
#69
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 3,690
Likes: 256
Blended rate is for your fleet and seat. It’s the weighted average of the pay for all of the aircraft in the same type (321/320/319, etc.). Yes tax free.
05-14-2026 | 06:58 PM
#70
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 7,490
Likes: 484
No, but the way some of our pilots act over the very scary sick note, you'd think that this is the case lol. It seems some want to blow negotiating capital on something that isn't all that common for the vast majority of the pilot group.
Yup, it's an important distinction that the note isn't required until a sick call in the month AFTER you trip 120 hours of sick usage. So if you started the month with 119 hours, you could call out for a few 5 days, pushing you up over 170 hours of sick and you still wouldn't be required to provide a note. You would need a note the next month if you called in sick AND your 12 month lookback didn't happen to drop below 120 hours. Extreme example, but it's possible.
Taken further, once you hit your 4th or 5th year, you could call out sick for a 4 day every other month, for the rest of your career and you'd never need a note. You'd also never run out of sick leave because your it resets every 1Jun. For most of your career, you'd even still have another 100-150 hours of sick, over and above these callouts.
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