Will jetBlue be here in 5-10 years???
02-17-2006, 07:28 PM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: CA 767
Posts: 402
It is his First Airline that he's in charge of. Dont try to bend the facts. He was a middle manager at Morris and SWA. And yes I would love to see all LCC fail. The employees that take these jobs to me are No better than Scabs. Destroying the occupation. I know I'm going to get alot of Flack, but thousands feel the way I do.
02-17-2006, 08:56 PM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Guppy Capt.
Posts: 1,887
NashMD11,
You never answered a post back on page 2, so I will try again...
"And what co. do you work for? I hope you get paid THE MOST OF ALL carriers, 'cause if you work for one penny less, then you too are "undercutting" your peers."
And are being a scab. Also, do you consider TED and Song to also be LCCs?
You never answered a post back on page 2, so I will try again...
"And what co. do you work for? I hope you get paid THE MOST OF ALL carriers, 'cause if you work for one penny less, then you too are "undercutting" your peers."
And are being a scab. Also, do you consider TED and Song to also be LCCs?
02-17-2006, 11:32 PM
#73
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by Nashmd11
It is his First Airline that he's in charge of. Dont try to bend the facts. He was a middle manager at Morris and SWA. And yes I would love to see all LCC fail. The employees that take these jobs to me are No better than Scabs. Destroying the occupation. I know I'm going to get alot of Flack, but thousands feel the way I do.
02-18-2006, 06:13 AM
#74
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: CA 767
Posts: 402
Yes I fly an Md-11, you can figure out the rest. And many, many feel the Occupation is going down the toilet because of pilots like one's at JB want to fly transcon in one duty period and break the 8 hour flight rule without the flight being augmented. Total disregard of the blood sweat and tears of many pilots that worked over 50 years for better work rules.
02-18-2006, 08:17 AM
#75
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: A320
Posts: 76
Originally Posted by Nashmd11
Yes I fly an Md-11, you can figure out the rest. And many, many feel the Occupation is going down the toilet because of pilots like one's at JB want to fly transcon in one duty period and break the 8 hour flight rule without the flight being augmented. Total disregard of the blood sweat and tears of many pilots that worked over 50 years for better work rules.
And where the he** were you when the enitre industry was charging for ground school? If you really are out to "defend the profession", you wouldn't have such a narrow focus. There are a heck of a lot of issues "industry defenders" could focus on, but don't because it doesn't affect them this very second. It's no wonder pilots are out for themselves when, in the mid-nineties, they were told the process of getting on at an airline was a personal matter. Even if it included paying 15 grand to the commuter airline of their choice. And yes, there are co-workers of yours that did it too. That didn't make them scabs, but taking a job with the best (and first) company to offer you a job (just speaking of ones that don't have a current picket line) does? I carry a scab list, and I have yet to see a single PFTer on there, solely for (quite literally) selling out the profession. I think you need to self-evaluate a little.
Respectfully,
JayDub
02-18-2006, 09:13 AM
#76
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Guppy Capt.
Posts: 1,887
Originally Posted by Nashmd11
Yes I fly an Md-11, you can figure out the rest. And many, many feel the Occupation is going down the toilet because of pilots like one's at JB want to fly transcon in one duty period and break the 8 hour flight rule without the flight being augmented. Total disregard of the blood sweat and tears of many pilots that worked over 50 years for better work rules.
Do you think TED, or Song are LCC's. Then they too are scabs. Even though they work for United, Delta. How about ALPA members? We at Spirit are ALPA.
We have been asked for concessions,twice, and we said NO! Not patting myself on the back,but we are at least trying to hold the bar, if not raise it, all be a little.
You might as well go to EVERY airline that took concessions, and call them scabs. Why not? They didn't have the brass ones to stand up for the pilots who in the past 50 years through blood sweat and tears worked for better work rules, and better pay.
COME ON!!!
You actually have REAL scabs aat almost EVERY airline. I hope you list them in you bids NOT to fly with them. And you hope they get fired, and "out on the streets".?
02-18-2006, 09:59 AM
#77
Guest
Posts: n/a
There are some folks at every airline that will ride on the backs of others just to save a few bucks. There also others that will finish their year with a 0 balance in their sick day bank. We each have to develope our own guide lines. Song[soon to go away] used regular Delta mainline pilots. Don't know about TED, but assume it's the same. Face it, flying is an "addiction".
02-18-2006, 10:04 AM
#78
Need More Callouts
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Unbridled Enthusiasm
Posts: 2,143
Originally Posted by Joel Payne
There also others that will finish their year with a 0 balance in their sick day bank.
600 times $200/hour is a lot of dough to leave behind.
02-19-2006, 09:51 PM
#80
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Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by SitBackRelax
My opinion (and take it with a grain of salt -- I work at JB)... "everyone" doesn't dislike Neeleman. I think most people are watching what he does with great curiosity and an open mind, because up to this point... well, if nothing else, he's built a successful company very quickly. And he has the respect of both his employees and his customers. Or at the very least the flying public seems to really like the product.
HOWEVER, and this is a big however, most of the posters here are going to be fairly polarized to both ends. Most of the JB guys, including the ones who came from other airlines (which is the majority) will probably tell you that he's helped to build a fantastic place to work and that by and large he's earned our trust. Most of the guys on the other end of the spectrum are generally upset that JB pilots are happy with lower-than-legacy wages, fewer benefits than have been offered in the past, no pension plan, no lifelong contract, and have not unionized. In addition, some feel that this has caused, or at least contributed significantly, to the problems in the industry in the last several years. Many find him a cult-like figure who gives lip-service to the "take care of your people" / "Ultimately I'm not in this to make billions" stuff but has actually found a new and better way to exploit his workforce, with their compliance!
As to where it all went wrong, it hasn't yet. We had an unprofitable year and may have another. That's all. The rest is just wild speculation, because where are you going to do that if not an internet discussion board?
I personally think he's a great guy, I respect him, and I tend to take him at his word. I've talked to him a few times and seen him speak several more, and my gut-level response is that he's sincere. Is he still a businessman? Oh yes. So your initial posts came off as a little naive. And I don't know where you got the idea that he "took the place over" from someone else. But I wouldn't go writing off JB, Neeleman, or anyone else based on psychobabble on a message board.
My $.02
HOWEVER, and this is a big however, most of the posters here are going to be fairly polarized to both ends. Most of the JB guys, including the ones who came from other airlines (which is the majority) will probably tell you that he's helped to build a fantastic place to work and that by and large he's earned our trust. Most of the guys on the other end of the spectrum are generally upset that JB pilots are happy with lower-than-legacy wages, fewer benefits than have been offered in the past, no pension plan, no lifelong contract, and have not unionized. In addition, some feel that this has caused, or at least contributed significantly, to the problems in the industry in the last several years. Many find him a cult-like figure who gives lip-service to the "take care of your people" / "Ultimately I'm not in this to make billions" stuff but has actually found a new and better way to exploit his workforce, with their compliance!
As to where it all went wrong, it hasn't yet. We had an unprofitable year and may have another. That's all. The rest is just wild speculation, because where are you going to do that if not an internet discussion board?
I personally think he's a great guy, I respect him, and I tend to take him at his word. I've talked to him a few times and seen him speak several more, and my gut-level response is that he's sincere. Is he still a businessman? Oh yes. So your initial posts came off as a little naive. And I don't know where you got the idea that he "took the place over" from someone else. But I wouldn't go writing off JB, Neeleman, or anyone else based on psychobabble on a message board.
My $.02
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