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Originally Posted by reCALcitrant
(Post 392207)
Let me get this straight. They would furlough 200 guys to save $6,000,000 in a year ($30,000x200 people)?? Some of them have no medical hense, no cost. YGBFSM! This is the dumbest way to save money and the quickest way to have an employee group that doesn't give a **** about the company! We were hiring until March I think. Nice planning! Exactly why we should never give in to what these bastards want. Our jobs mean nothing to them.:mad:
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Originally Posted by Spaceman Spliff
(Post 392500)
Not bloody likely. They "new blood" is too busy trying to figure out how to afford heath care for their families, and how to apply for food stamps.
Good job, senior CAL guys. I hope you get yours soon. Should I hope that all junior people get furloughed just because I've flown with a few jerk-off F/O's? Its half-baked statements like yours that create division amongst the ranks Space-boy. |
Last month at the Kellener/Moran meeting. They stated that furloughing new pilots for less than 18mos was more expensive than keeping them on the property. Speaks volumes of our contract. I'm not too worried though, furloughs are always a threat during contract negotiations. And correct me if I'm wrong, but we are still a growing airline at the end of said 18 months. If management were smart, they'd furlough the bottom 2,000 guys for the duration of TA voting. They'd get exactly what they wanted from the union...again. I'm hoping for some "Killer B", A/A style, from the new guys next year. If any of the B's have any reflection, I'd love to hear it.
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Originally Posted by CHQ Pilot
(Post 392514)
Not that your logic is too far off given the magnitude of increases in fuel costs, but the cost of an employee is far greater than the straight pay. I don't know anything about the CAL structure, but you would have also have to look at the cost of insurance and benefits, cost of continued training, cost of any pay step increases, etc to get a true value on what it costs a company to keep an employee hired without a need. Does CAL bring pilots back with longevity increases as if you had never left if they put them on the street? In tough financial times, the bean counters take over and look for every possible way to save a buck disregarding company morale or a long term strategy. Hope this all works out soon.
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Originally Posted by CHQ Pilot
(Post 392514)
...In tough financial times, the bean counters take over and look for every possible way to save a buck disregarding company morale or a long term strategy...
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Some highly speculative math in public: 105 737-300 & 737-500 jets to possibly park.
737 orders for 2008: I'm guessing that we're getting another 15 or so jets this year to make 33 total 737s in 2009: 24 737s for 2010: 10 I'm not even going to guess about the 787 deliveries. The net change: minus 55 jets. I'm not sure what the crew ratios are or how many pilots that equates to. Also not sure how many retirements will happen. Surely ALPA will help me put food on the table. |
:(
Originally Posted by Riddler
(Post 392695)
Some highly speculative math in public: 105 737-300 & 737-500 jets to possibly park.
737 orders for 2008: I'm guessing that we're getting another 15 or so jets this year to make 33 total 737s in 2009: 24 737s for 2010: 10 I'm not even going to guess about the 787 deliveries. The net change: minus 55 jets. I'm not sure what the crew ratios are or how many pilots that equates to. Also not sure how many retirements will happen. Surely ALPA will help me put food on the table. |
Originally Posted by Riddler
(Post 392695)
...
The net change: minus 55 jets. I'm not sure what the crew ratios are or how many pilots that equates to. ... 5079 total pilots on the seniority list 4912 pilots are flying in June 2908 pilots on the 737 1417 pilots on the 756 587 pilots on the 777 If the count of aircraft on APC is correct, then there are 10.8 pilots flying per 737, 16.9 pilots flying per 756, and 29.4 pilots flying per 777. This should be pretty close. |
Originally Posted by A320fumes
(Post 392708)
:(
I don't think the intent is to park all 48 300's. Think they would scrap all 500's if possible. How does that affect our intn'l feed? esp with widebodies coming. Ceding market-share is not the answer right now. 300's with winglets are at least market neutral when providing int'l feed. The company hasn't even expressed the desire to park all of the 300's. I think they have a lot more desire to use furlough as a scare tactic to get the kind of contracts that they are used too. Furlough is tough, but bearible. I got furloughed and made twice as much money as I would have working for CAL in year 1-2. During my last furlough, I made more than I make as a CAL 73 Captain now. As a pilot group, we need to let them know that if they furlough the most junior of us, They will have to pay more in the long haul, ie respectable contract. We should fight for every pilot to stay on the property. If we can't achieve that, we should cover their health insurance & travel benefits. Don't just roll over this time. If we don't eat our young, as in the past, they can return to real careers. And our ability to suck it up might actually cause some of these 64.5 year olds to leave. At their time. |
Originally Posted by A320fumes
(Post 392708)
:(
I don't think the intent is to park all 48 300's. Think they would scrap all 500's if possible. How does that affect our intn'l feed? esp with widebodies coming. Ceding market-share is not the answer right now. 300's with winglets are at least market neutral when providing int'l feed. The company hasn't even expressed the desire to park all of the 300's. I think they have a lot more desire to use furlough as a scare tactic to get the kind of contracts that they are used too. Furlough is tough, but bearible. I got furloughed and made twice as much money as I would have working for CAL in year 1-2. During my last furlough, I made more than I make as a CAL 73 Captain now. As a pilot group, we need to let them know that if they furlough the most junior of us, They will have to pay more in the long haul, ie respectable contract. We should fight for every pilot to stay on the property. If we can't achieve that, we should cover their health insurance & travel benefits. Don't just roll over this time. If we don't eat our young, as in the past, they can return to real careers. And our ability to suck it up might actually cause some of these 64.5 year olds to leave. At their time. |
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