flybynuts

I have the opportunity to leave CAL after a year to come to SWA in a few months.
I was hoping to get some information from line operators to help me make a sound decision. I don’t want this to be a CAL or SWA bash contest. Just pearls of wisdom to aid me in choosing what is best for me. Amazing how a year can change things as far as perspectives go.

I actually like CAL and think it is a good Legacy and will be after all this mess. I believe it could be a great company in the next 3-6 years. Why? The old bottom feeding mentality will have been retired out of the company when 65 hits a good 1200-1500 senior pilots. There is about 2000-3000 young guys here that are ready to take the helm and could make a great pilot group. The next contract should net a 10-30% pay raise. Couple this with parking all the lower paying 300 and 500s this should help by another 10.00 per hour. However, there is a lot that can go wrong with my assumptions too.

I want to hear form SW guys about their thoughts and insight into the company. I hear that the company is going to hit a “wall” with domestic growth dwindling and once the hedges run out SW will be like everyone else. I know SWA has fought other walls before and conquered them well. Where is SWA headed for the future? International?

Most say that you work 15 days a month for the rest of your life and have the 3 on 4 off schedule until you retire. How many guys actually have 18+ days off a month or how many work less than 15 day a month? I know you guys have good schedule flexibility though.

This last 500-900 you hiring over the next 2 years could be the last for a while. What’s the odds of sitting on the bottom for years and taking a long time to upgrade? How many 65 guys are hurting the company in the sense of upgrade time?

Finally, what are likes and dislikes of flying for SWA? How is the AUS commute to HOU?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Flyby

757Driver

Can't think of one reason not to leave.

CAL:

1. Insanely weak Pilots Union.
2. Uncaring management that uses its employees like toilet paper and for all their lip service could really give a d#@n about you.
3. Fellow employees who gleefully pick up trips while we are furloughing with some doing so in the right seat even though they are Captains.

SWA:

1. Management that truly cares about its employees and wants to run a successful airline and not line their pockets in the short term.
2. Good wages and a solid financial record.
3. Happy employees who like their jobs, (see above on management).

Best of luck with your decision but to me its a true no-brainer.

Ottopilot

Airlines can change over night. Look back into history. SWA can change too. Don't take any disgruntled CAL pilots advice only. Listen to everyone and make the best choice for you. The grass in not always greener.

757Driver

What would you do Otto? Aren't you close to losing your seat as a Captain and how do you feel about the way we are treated over here?

There were two Pilots who left CAL around 2004 and both had more than 14 years each on the payroll at CAL. I'm told both those guys are thrilled they left and couldn't be happier.

Silver2Gold

Flybynuts,

I am in a very similar situation, but with DAL vs SWA. Like you, I am happy with the company and like the direction things are going. However, living in South Texas and commuting to HOU seems to lend itself to a better QOL then the trek to JFK or ATL. In addition to items 1-3 from 757Driver, amongst others, the decisions seems to be getting easier. I am trying to see past the short term pain of new hire pay, probation, and sitting reserve and imagine a "5 years from now" comparison (of course, based on today's information.) There are guys at my company who worked for 13+ years to sit in my seat - and I do not take that for granted. I'm grateful for what I have, which does not make the decision any easier. Best of luck with your decision.

Riddler

Flyby,

I'm a new hire/new furlough at CAL, I've never been at SWA but I have a ton of friends there.

I'm sure you know the disadvantages of CAL, particularly when it comes to scheduling and sitting reserve.

SWA's scheduling system is much more flexible and lends itself to trip trading. Picking up open time and VJM seems to be the norm and not the exception. As a result, my buddies are better able to manage their 4/3 schedule.

Some disadvantages: plan on spending some quality time at OAK, then probably LAS or PHX. HOU seems fairly senior. Also, plan on a longer upgrade. SWA has some older pilots, but its main boom was in the past 10 years, so its crew force is younger than CAL. Yes, their fuel hedges will erode at their competitive advantage, but lets face it: SWA has pretty much controlled domestic rates, so if its costs rise, it's a fair guess that they would be able to handle it without pilot concessions.

Good luck, there's a lot of CAL guys looking to follow your footsteps.

Riddler

Ottopilot

I'm not in a position to choose. I have not even applied to SWA. I'm telling the guy to get a lot of advice besides just CAL pilots. That's all I'm saying. My seniority and position are not part of HIS decision. This thread is NOT about me and my career.

Slam55

FlyBy,

Congrats on having such a difficult decision to make!

As Otto said, don't let any one disgruntled individual influence your choice. There are advantages and disadvantages to being a pilot for either carrier. Obviously we have some problems at CAL to address with regard to pay and benefits for our most junior pilots, but I'm confident we'll get that done. Hopefully by the time you have to make a decision whether to return or not.

I have about 20 good friends(former squadron mates)at SWA, and have nothing negative to say about the personality of that entire pilot group. You'll have an incredible experience, but I don't envy the decision you'll be faced with down the road.

Good luck, and again, congratulations!

-SLAM55

ACEFLYERSWA

I seriously doubt this will happen.


I don't think we are going to hit a "wall",we are hiring 500 this year and will hire 500 next year. Our contract calls for at least 5% growth a year.
People always say "when our hedges run out".Our hedges will probably never run out ,we are hedging through 2012. I am not saying that they will help us like they have in the past but who knows. We will probably go international, but don't make a decision on something that may not happen

You can work as much as you want or as little as you want.

Who says this could be the last 500-900 for a while, I haven't heard this. 65 guys are hurting every company for upgrade!

Good company, most everyone enjoys working there.I worked for COEX and had a class date at CAL, if I was going to work for a Legacy I would pick CAL, but I chose SWA and I'm glad I came over. Commute from AUS to HOU is easy could even go to DAL as a FO.

bigoober

Ace,

Thanks for the replies which seem honest enough to me from asking my friends about their experiences at SW.

I'm somewhat in the same boat. I'll find out the decision this week.

Otto, I see what you are trying to say but I have found it hard to find the disgruntled CAL pilot. Everything that was said seems true in my short time with CAL. These things that can't be seen until you are on the inside. I am sure that SWA has its own problems, but they pale in comparison to the way the pilot is treated even amongst fellow pilots at CAL. I cringe every time I hear management talk about trying to get the furloughees back on property quickly.

Good luck to you flybynuts. I know what I would do but you are going about your decision in the right way it seems.