x 2.

APA has plenty of leverage to maintain our retirement, keep scope, AND get us a pay raise while keeping PBS DOA. And AMR knows it.

That's the spirit. Hard to believe you are willing to go on strike for PBS or will strike before taking a concession of any kind.

Instituting PBS equates to probably losing 1500-2000 jobs.

Self-help? Believe it. Make no mistake, it WILL happen if the company continues on its present course of quibbling, stalling, showing up for negotiations "unprepared" to discuss issues . . . in other words, refusing to negotiate in good faith.

Wait until AA loses the arbitration on the commuter clause exception for Eagle and several other arbitrations. I think as a minimum the 25 70 seat jets are getting yanked from Eagle and the 50 seater operation is going transform itself back into what it was meant to be, an efficient turboprop true feeder operation or just get crushed by its own weight of inefficient sub-50 seat jets. The manure pile is really going to hit the fan this summer. The abject failure of the senior leadership to actually lead the employees of the company is reaching its day of reckoning.

This information is readily available, and was taken from, the company website aapilots.com.

If you would like to call them up and tell them they are wrong, be my guest.

The first age 65 retirement won't take place until December of 2012. The 146 figure is based solely on the age 65 retirement. My guess is that perhaps 100 or so will retire "early" in 2009. Thanks to the number of geezers working past age 60, we are all in for three or four more years of stagnation.

Saw a pretty extended piece on AA last night on CNBC.... interesting. Quite fascinating that Bob Crandall stated he would "never" invest in an airline, but that it was one of the greatest places to work.

As far as early retirements, do the active AA guys still think you will have a bunch of early retirements in 2009 with the marked devaluation of the market and hence, the fund? I thought the guys that decided to stay on and not get out as of DEC 1, 08 were basically flying for "free" for a couple of years due to the fact that they gave up being able to retire with the market correlation of SEP 08. Am I all wrong? :confused:

I don't know much (anything) about AA's current scheduling system. Seems like there's quite a debate between the current system and a possible PBS. Could someone quickly throw out the pros and cons of the current system versus a PBS at AA? Thanks!

Current system: good
PBS: sucks

No, seriously, PBS is a management tool that eliminates the inefficiencies of lines of flying. Some airlines have/had good systems (DAL, TWA) while others got shafted (CAL, UAL.) It all has to do with how much of a hand the union has in it. In a nutshell, PBS builds trip pairings out of seniority preferences whereas lines of flying are just that. PBS eliminates conflicts such as vacation drops and monthly fly-through conflicts. It is so efficient that it's been said to eliminate 5-10% of the seniority list.

AA pilots are dead set against it mainly because we simply don't trust our management. Even though the APA would supposedly have to have a hand in it, we know how our management works - empty bag promises, manipulation of high/low reserve coverage days, that sort of thing. When we got TTOT (Trip trade w/ open time) in the '97 contract, we were promised that we would have complete control of our monthly schedule trades and drops. The reality is the exact opposite - the company controls our trades and drops based on THEIR interpretation of reserve coverage, which probably varies according to how much they feel like screwing with the pilots on a day to day basis. Not exactly what we signed for. And if we end up with PBS, the same exact thing will happen.

PBS is a non-issue for us. We like our lines of flying and our trip conflicts just fine. It also helps our furloughees come back that much sooner.

73

73,

It took me awhile to understand why the nAAtive pilot's mentality is so anti-PBS, but what you describe I believe to be true. This is tough as (being a former TWA guy) I know PBS to have worked very well in the past. Averaging less than 10 minutes a month to bid was great.

Then again, we had great work rules and a management that wanted to see PBS work without alienating the pilots. Different time, different place.

So I have to ask:

When push comes to shove, if the choice between dropping the A-Plan or invoking PBS is presented...what will it be?

X

Pbs
 

You guys are mixing up PBS with changing the work rules. The only way that the company gains with preferential bidding, is if other rules change. If you insist that the other rules not change, then there is no downside to PBS - only good. When I hear someone say that it costs jobs - that is just not correct. It does cost jobs if other rules get changed at the same time. If you do not allow that to happen, then productivity does not change. It is as simple as that.