Republic to buy USair.

Actually heard something similiar to that. Only RAH gets the East. Good friend of mine is a 20+ year Airways Capt. and we were talking on the phone and he brought that up. Guess it's the rumor floating around at Airways.

When he asked what I thought, I couldn't help but laugh. He got p****d and asked why I laughed. Told him it was quite the funny rumor. What I really wanted to say is their pilot group is the last thing we need.

Fortunately, rumors are like A**h***s, everyone has got one!

Joker

I don't think this is what texas was saying at all. An example is Mesa. Mesa opperates CRJ-900 aircraft for US Airways but the contract they run on was signed between Mesa and America West. So ((((IF)))) AA/US would happen AA might beable to have RAH and Mesa opperate the 90 seat aircraft under the contract they signed with US/AW.

:rolleyes:

Yawn...

I wouldn't be surprised on that one
 

Brian Bedford (RAH CEO) has said he is interested in buying another carrier, for cheap, of course. So U would need to file BK for BB to go after them. This guy is the master of getting around scope clauses.

He would only want the A320s and E190s and tie them into the F9/YX network.

They can go the way of Reno, TWA, and every other company AMR assimilated... it will be slowly dismantled until all that is left is what AA looks like today...

Don't be yawning, better watch your 6
 

Read some of the recent posts on the Latest and Greatest DAL thread. They are realizing the threat that the E190 flown by regional groups poses to mainline .

I think a few months is more like it. LCC is already bumping off their cash covenant for the credit card processor. After that triggers, the dominoes fall pretty quick.

If so, that would seem to leave UAL without a dance partner and they'd flop for sure............of course, perhaps that's the idea.

Not if they're smart.

AMR is anything but dumb (well usually). My guess is AMR will join the rest of the crowd and avoid Mesa like a scorching case of herpes.

The LCC pilots would probably be too busy fighting and calling each other stupid to even realize they were getting sold off in peices. I wonder what happens to a judgment when the parties don't exist anymore.

This goes to show you...no matter what side of the fence you're on (AA or Eagle), if your pay check says AMR, we're all screwed!

Yes I'm sure someone with as much class as yourself could just walk up to the APA and they would just hand you the keys to their newest 777, you know with relative seniority and all.
Do you really think all your 3rd grade insults are endearing you to the AA or any other pilots?
Yea you get alot of kudos from the internet tough guy crowd but that wont help when you are being stapled.
So why dont you do yourself and your fellow pilots, yes even East a favor and try to come up with a fair way to merge groups if this rumor ever came true.
If you think AAA was bad try telling those in line for the 777 how relatively D.O. is really senior to them.
I believe if you spent a fraction of the time you spend insulting East pilots on every board on the net, trying to figure this out, you have a good chance of coming up with something. Good luck we will all need it.

Parker has already made it public knowledge that he would like a merger with AA.

Misinformation. AMR needs cash. There will be a swap of slots. AMR has LGA no DCA. USairways has still a lot of LGA and extra DCA. U swaps DCA for some of AMR's ORD. In this economy bartering has replaced cash, the airlines are no different.

Look for Delta empty gates at ORD to go to USairways. USairways presently has gates in terminal 2, Northwest also has gates in terminal 2. Delta is going to move to terminal 2. Do the math.

Gate changes predicted for Chicago O'Hare - Executive Travel Magazine

I don't know. Your math might be old. That article was published in February 2009. These rumors are fresh. The US Air boys may get their divorce wish granted.

Nice, all I said is that usapa is run by a bunch of scumbag idiots that don't stand a chance against the apa and I have no doubt the lcc pilots would all get stapled, that would include me and you.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there some type of recent legislation regarding fair and equitable integration regarding mergering labor groups recently ?

You mean binding arbitration? The east pilots don't recognize that.

I just don’t see this happening, at least not anytime soon. The big play AMR is banking on is a merger with BA/Iberia, which is supposedly coming this fall or winter. AA and BA have been working to make this happen for a decade. AMR is not thinking domestically as much as globally.

The sad thing, AA will be to BA to what Eagle is to AA – just a feed.

With the credit markets frozen, airlines shrinking, and the current economic environment still clouded, I just don’t see any of the majors making a big play this time. It’s just too risky plus AMR doesn’t have access to the money/credit like they had in the past. AA is only doing slightly better than UAL and USAIR now, which doesn’t exactly put us into that good of a position to be buying an airline.

The other plausible scenario is for the stronger players to wait for USAIR and UAL to fall into BK and then pluck off the pieces like vultures. Sad but true.

On the other hand……you just never know. Best of luck to all of us.

AA767AV8TOR

There are plenty of 'leaders' (airline execs) within this industry, many past-some present, that would not be coined the term 'smart'.

As you well know, there have been numerous 'business decisions' made in the past that have lead many of us to say "W.T.*. was that about??"

Lesson of the day: Never discount the possiblity if the ability is an 'option' sitting right there......Wanting it bad enough ('smart' or otherwise).....if there's a will, they will find a way. :cool:

Is the likelyhood of a marriage between the present AA/U real?? Probably not.

I agree that AMR is much more concerned about getting approval for the BA/IB deal but I wouldn't put it past our government to demand a quid pro quo.

For example, Parker and Tilton tell key Congressmen and Senators they're going bankrupt and this time, without an available credit market plus the fact that they've hocked everthing already, it'll cause the companies to close their doors, Chapter 7. The boobs in Washington hear the sound of voters in their district losing their jobs and they see they have the power to make demands on AMR in order to grant the BA deal. Congressmen call on Arpey/AMR and say "We've got a deal for you, buy ...LCC/UAL or parts of it and we'll grant you the BA deal this fall." It will ensure everyone suffers a little instead of half the crowd suffering a lot.

Call me a conspiricy theorist but I don't trust executives in this country OR Congress.

I thought the same thing until Willie Walsh decided he couldn't pay his employees and asked a bunch to work for free.. BA is not as financially solvent as many here believe.

AA

Something USAPA has no concept of. APA is no bastion of goodwill either. They even ate thier own at one time. Remember B Scale.
The two groups together would bring down what's left of public respect for the profession.

I give you credit for looking at all pieces of the puzzle. I think everyone of those executives is factoring in alliances in their decision-making. I would also add that we've already seen what fear of bankruptcy does. I wouldn't put it past pilots and other employees to actively lobby for foreign investment.

Had the European economies (and airlines) stayed disproportionately strong, we might have seen more of this already. I think it's only the fact that credit markets were essentially closed that prevented more European forays into our side while they were still much stronger. With credit markets thawing, and investors willing to take on more risk, who knows what the future holds? I suspect it involves more arrangements, similar to our DAL / AF-KLM JV, with some agreements on division of flying. The focus will be on STAR next, and I suppose CAL/UAL will (e)merge as a strong partner to Lufthansa. AMR will be next to come up with an arrangement that works well within OneWorld. I never discount AMR. It's not immediately apparent to me how they're going to do well right now, but it never pays to understimate them.

And the Easties would have to play the ALPA way again. Crow pie served cold.


Sorry, I just think that would be funnier than "F" expletive.

Not sure what you are directing at me? If you are providing a history lesson, you are too late. I am well versed in what has transpired in our industry from inception.

I am very well aware of APA's past, and ALPAs as well as respective pilot groups and their negative contributions.

However when events occur that are positive, maybe, just maybe they can modeled and built upon for the good of our profession.

In the end I applauded what I thought was a rather professional, honorable "MERGER" between DAL and NWA.


Thanks for your insightful contribution to this thread and our future as whole by dwelling on the past.

AA

Excellent post.

AA

Agreed.


Just like AMR buying TWA to counter a UAL/U marraige that never happened. It cost them 800 mil for all the purchasing and another 800 mil to dump most everything including most of their fleet, routes and hubs. All they kept was some of their equipment and employees, most of which they furloughed.

But I sincerely hope that even AMR wouldn't be stupid enough to allow their precious rep (or so THEY believe) to be placed in the hands of Mesa and that was the crux of my assumption of the absence of COMPLETE stupidity.

WE can only hope:(

AA

Also, it's interesting to me how we believe rumors we like. The A'A guys see a dismantlement of LCC, which is totally cashless and out of options and has no nice pieces left, so Parker spends a lot of time on his knees servicing Arpey. The East/West guys wake up every morning trying not to say "you're ruining my life , I hope you die", instead of "pass me the butter please", so, naturally, they hear about a divorce. And the good part (their part) goes somewhere nice, because AMR has to be nice, since they're cahsless and ou of options, and need the juicy LCC (East or West) pieces because they're so good.

Then you have pilots, in general, that hear the whole thing hinges on a seniority deal, and labor peace, and so Arpey and Parker and spending their evenings together arguing staple vs. DOH.

I tend to believe that it can't possibly be more heinous than the LCC merger, from a labor perspective, but still I can't help but note that every trip I hear a handful of cactii across the pond. So the airline still runs, USAPA tantrums notwhistanding.

And since no amount of infighting has ever shut down an airline, but since infighting has weakened many a union, and resulted in many a lousy contract, I conclude that you and me (meaning pilots) are very, very low down the list when Arpey and Parker get talking.

I think the whole thing has to do with what pieces make sense where. And (for example) it sure makes a lot of sense to me, from LCC's perspective, to give Delta LGA, in order to create something even bigger with AMR.

I think we'll all be quite surprised (not pleasantly) when we see what the results of these discussions are. And everyone will probably be disappointed to know their feelings were never a consideration.

No dissappointment here.

After 20 years at Eagle, you've got to stand in line to kick me in the acorns. For me, this situation, if true (and I'm skeptical) would only be another whack in my already numb groin.

Good post, agreed. Hopefully, the past won't be repeated.

Let's hope so on that assumption, b/c I am thinking the same as well.

As many of us have seen in the recent years, it's not always the codeshare/or regional partner that does it the best who gets the 'flying'. Sometimes 'they' (Execs/BODs/shareholders) want the cheapest means to make it work in the lean present day market. Make no bits about it, the cheapest bid on the regional flying contracts can often (not always) lead to those awarded to do the flying for various mainline carriers.

When it comes to carriers like the one you mentioned earlier, it's easy to see how mgt can go ahead and "step over the dollar to save the penny".

Not good.

I'm sorry,"Compatible fleets with LCC"?

Really? UAL has 20 -/+ 744's, 50-ish 777's and another 30 -/+ 763's and LCC has first run 762's from PI that aren't true ER frames and maybe what, 15 Airbus 330's?

I seem to remember in 2000 US Air crews making dopey comments about "Getting their 747 manuals" and "Flying to Sydney".

No way in hell UAL or AMR pull LCC into the lifeboat.

A quote from one of your previous posts;

"Throw all of the accusations about favoritism out there you want to. Let me share a few observations with you from my 29 years of ATC."

Interesting, the ATC folks were striking about the time you got hired.

I seem to remember in 1990 United Pilots "Flying to Sydney" back then.

UAL Pilots As Scabs

The hypocrisy laden comments on this thread is endless.

Fleet compatiblity means Zero. Route structure means more. LCC does not really compliment either UAL or AA very much. not enough to buy them anyways.

I think the LCC and AA guys are getting worked up over too much.

RAH will end up owning most of the domestic LCC assets, then they will go hunting for VA and Spirit, then thier dominitation will be complete!

Agreed, calm it down a notch boys. Arpey is smart financially, and there is no way AMR will buy LCC outright. At most I could see some pieces being bought like the E190 fleet, some terminal space, slots, but there is no way in hell the two companies will merge.




Smartest post of the thread. Whatever the outcome is with USAir, two groups working towards the same goal is always preferable.

I don't think LCC is an attractive merger partner by any means, but I am hurt that you all would leave us standing in a corner at the big dance, particularly when you know we will put out.

Here's another kicker in any discussion of the new US Airways - Doug Parker's ego. There were pretty intense discussions between Parker and Tilton this past spring and they were done in ultimately by Tilton not willing to turn the reigns over to Doogie. Parker wants to be the Big Guy and he will sell us all out to get what he thinks he is entitled to. Same deal with CO and UAL, CEO egos are involved. Someone is going to have to be the beeotch in these deals and take one for the team or else get paid beacoup bucks to go away.

Labor issues will not drag on because you have the example of DAL/NWA and the Nic award as the seniority list that has been set. AA (or whoever) has their widebodies protected and everything else gets ratioed in. AA guts the hubs and we all wind up on furlough and have to get on with our lives.

Ce la Vie