... I'm not smart...

didnt read the thread title...

just started typing....

great briefing

oooops.

i posted all that on the wrong post.. i'll duplicate and move over to latest and greatest...

WHOOPS

Two things in response.

1. Small jet scope restoration is probably the single most achievable item if the company isn't profitable. It's tough to get payraises without profits. It's much easier to take back contracted flying when costs are low or management needs to reduce stress on a deal. We've done it before in a concessionary environment (BAE-146's at ASA).

2. Alaska has something we don't and that we can only get by competing (unprofitably) with them out of LAX...north-south flows. USAirways, Delta, UAL, then American all tried that trick, and all failed. All the destinations announced for AK service already existed under the NWA codeshare (they brought it with them) and the vast majority are to leisure (low yield) markets. When swine flu goes away, the North American economy rebounds or Asia traffic through LAX returns, my bet is you will see a return of some of those flights. In the 90's Delta had non-stops from LAX to 7 Mexican destinations that also connected to SFO, PDX, SEA, ANC, YVR, YYC and YED. Canadian open skies killed the north-south flow, and the Mexican beach markets went away. We don't need to fight for what we can't win in our current configuration. I'd prefer management save the capital to compete in markets where we can win and make a profit. I also hope that someday soon we merge with AK to end the competitive problem, but that's just me.

1) We agree that top-end scope (for lack of a better term) is just as crucial, if not more, as 76-seat scope. I'm not sure we would necessarily like the resultant language if we were to enter a JV with JAL, for example. I understand the AF/KLM JV codifies a % of flying for each side, but I'm not sure if that % is public. Interestingly, while we're cutting international 15% this winter, AF is cutting 3%.

2) As stated by other since your last reply, there remains a difference of opinion in that I do not view it as our duty to make sure DAL is offered a cost-neutral alternative to giving away our flying. The path that takes scope hawks to the MEC, where they are humbled by the numbers, and join the fold is well-traveled. It's just that I am tired of a mentality whereby we actually had one of our MEC guys (a very smart guy, but sometimes a misguided individual) write papers arguing against flying the RJ at mainline. Somewhere in there there is another way, that works for both us and Delta. I think I see something along those lines in your last paragraph, above.

3) One factor that may play into this is new legislation that would reduce the availability (and increase the cost) of new regional pilots. It may very well be that in three years, with industry-wide Age 65 mandatory retirements, the only airline to sufficiently staff F/O ranks with 1,500-hour ATP's (and a clean record) will have to steal them from other regionals. At a steep premium. OR, at not-so-steep a premium, but an entry-level mainline position...

Thanks for the discussion.

Not ignoring you, but I don't quite have the time to look up everything you said about Moak. Besides, I probably didn't need to personify this as a Moak issue. My mistake.

The point I was trying to make is that your posts seem to be more about what others are doing wrong, rather than a credible, realistic alternative. Or, maybe it's just me. Maybe you're offering a clear plan, and I've missed it altogether. I prefer typing to reading: sometimes the appeal of my own prose is just too much...

At any rate, I'm willing to support resolutions and actions that a) enhance the information we receive about scope, b) require our MEC to pursue all Delta flying, and c) any pragmatic move that establishes common ground with the WO regionals, for the prupose of creating a prenup agreement, THEN trying to force a marriage in front of Mother Delta. I think that's specific enough, and would get the ball rolling enough.

Got plans until next week.

Thanks for the discussion.

Slow, do you feel OK??

I am encouraged to see you put "you" points of view down.
As you point our in bullet 1, this is one more reason to make it happen. Lets let the company take the stress out of it by giving us that flying.

Either way, I am happy to see the points and debate.