AA recalls
07-15-2011 | 07:30 AM
#311
Line Holder
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 88
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BullXXXX! Please stop with your unproven sunshine predictions. The facts are as follows.
AMR has publically announced that they will ground 25 more S80's before the end of the year. AMR has not announced any replacements for those aircraft. The deliveries of 737's will end this year. AMR was previously grounding at least one S80 every time they recieved a new 737 (I've been delivering the 80's to Roswell). 777-300ER will not be available for a year and a half, minimum. Likewise the 787. There have been no announcements of new aircraft besides the six - 300ER's. APA, our pilot union, is at best sending out mixed messages. Multiple domicile chairmen are stating that AMR management has been lying again at the negotiating table to get us through the summer crunch. The negotiating team sent out a message stating they are disappointed in managements tactics at the table then a few days later at the direction of what many believe is a management friendly APA President, the negotiators send out a conflicting message stating they are re-energized at the table. AMR recalled furloughees recently because they were fearful of a mass exodus of senior pilots this summer due to falling market conditions. (This has partially come true, 42 retirements July 1, maybe a similar number Aug 1). AMR is losing market share in major markets and has announced no plans to stem the losses other than waiting for the other airlines labor contracts to catch up. That's it folks. Facts not some pipe dreams are what you should plan your future on.
I could just as easily state, "According to the VP Flight they will stop recalls this fall after the summer crunch is over to prepare for the announced grounding of the 25 S-80's. There will be no more recalls until several months prior to AMR recieving 777-300ER's and then only if AMR has a signed agreement with APA by that time (which looks doubtful)".
aa73, you can try to be smug, act like you have the inside story and puff up the hopes of others but you know only as much as I know. Yes I have friends on the inside too! Pilots are making future plans based on message boards like this so please try to paint an accurate picture based on facts not your dreams. When conditions change I will be the first to back up your posts but until then I'll present the ACTUAL conditions present at AA.
AMR has publically announced that they will ground 25 more S80's before the end of the year. AMR has not announced any replacements for those aircraft. The deliveries of 737's will end this year. AMR was previously grounding at least one S80 every time they recieved a new 737 (I've been delivering the 80's to Roswell). 777-300ER will not be available for a year and a half, minimum. Likewise the 787. There have been no announcements of new aircraft besides the six - 300ER's. APA, our pilot union, is at best sending out mixed messages. Multiple domicile chairmen are stating that AMR management has been lying again at the negotiating table to get us through the summer crunch. The negotiating team sent out a message stating they are disappointed in managements tactics at the table then a few days later at the direction of what many believe is a management friendly APA President, the negotiators send out a conflicting message stating they are re-energized at the table. AMR recalled furloughees recently because they were fearful of a mass exodus of senior pilots this summer due to falling market conditions. (This has partially come true, 42 retirements July 1, maybe a similar number Aug 1). AMR is losing market share in major markets and has announced no plans to stem the losses other than waiting for the other airlines labor contracts to catch up. That's it folks. Facts not some pipe dreams are what you should plan your future on.
I could just as easily state, "According to the VP Flight they will stop recalls this fall after the summer crunch is over to prepare for the announced grounding of the 25 S-80's. There will be no more recalls until several months prior to AMR recieving 777-300ER's and then only if AMR has a signed agreement with APA by that time (which looks doubtful)".
aa73, you can try to be smug, act like you have the inside story and puff up the hopes of others but you know only as much as I know. Yes I have friends on the inside too! Pilots are making future plans based on message boards like this so please try to paint an accurate picture based on facts not your dreams. When conditions change I will be the first to back up your posts but until then I'll present the ACTUAL conditions present at AA.
American had already ordered 26 of the Boeing 737 aircraft. The airline disclosed Friday that it exercised an option to buy three more, and the AerCap deal also covered six planes to which American holds purchase rights.
They're all Boeing 737-800 aircraft that are typically used on flights within the United States.
Under the sale-leaseback arrangement, AerCap will buy the planes from American and lease them back to the airline.
Bella Goren, the chief financial officer of American parent AMR Corp., said the agreement showed that the airline can efficiently raise capital to update its jet fleet.
American reportedly is in talks for large new orders with aircraft makers Boeing and Airbus. Airline officials declined to comment on those reports Friday.
Fort Worth-based American, the nation's third-largest airline company, wants newer and more fuel-efficient planes to replace the MD-80 series aircraft that make up about one-third of its fleet of more than 600 planes.
Before Friday's announcement, the company expected to take delivery of 15 Boeing 737-800s this year, 28 next year and 14 in 2013.
AMR shares fell 8 cents to $5.01, while shares of Netherlands-based AerCap rose 30 cents, or 2.4 percent, to $12.60 in morning trading.
07-15-2011 | 07:50 AM
#312
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 416
Likes: 0
From: CFI
I'm probably talking out of turn, but it is conceivable AA could bring in new hire classes by next Spring. While retiring a cetain number of 80's, they are also brining online new 73's at a modest clip. Adding planes while grounding others isn't a bad thing, right?
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
07-15-2011 | 08:06 AM
#313
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 945
Likes: 0
I'm probably talking out of turn, but it is conceivable AA could bring in new hire classes by next Spring. While retiring a cetain number of 80's, they are also brining online new 73's at a modest clip. Adding planes while grounding others isn't a bad thing, right?
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
Is your glass half empty or half full? Based on AMR's past, mine is bone dry. Assuming AA doesn't go completely belly up, they will need to replace old airplanes and old pilots, but the big question is: Will it be a place anybody wants to work?
07-15-2011 | 09:31 AM
#314
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 945
Likes: 0
After re-reading my post above, I guess I need to tone down the whining. Some good things are happening: Furloughees are returning, old guys are retiring, and new jets are arriving. If they start hiring off the street in the next year, it COULD be a great place to be in terms of seniority advances down the road.
The thing that I find most frustrating, and what would keep AA at the bottom of my list of hopefuls if I were starting to seek an airline job, is the apparent lack of a growth strategy by the company, and absolutely horrid labor/management relations. AMR seems content to take a wait-and-see attitude (and has for years) on everything. They used to be aggressive, industry leaders. And maybe APA WILL get an "industry leading" contract, but 5+ years into the process, the signs of hope are few and far between.
Then again, I could be wrong...
The thing that I find most frustrating, and what would keep AA at the bottom of my list of hopefuls if I were starting to seek an airline job, is the apparent lack of a growth strategy by the company, and absolutely horrid labor/management relations. AMR seems content to take a wait-and-see attitude (and has for years) on everything. They used to be aggressive, industry leaders. And maybe APA WILL get an "industry leading" contract, but 5+ years into the process, the signs of hope are few and far between.
Then again, I could be wrong...
07-15-2011 | 03:53 PM
#316
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 157
Likes: 0
From: Left or Right, Whatev'
Why does the American Airlines quicktake still show 1842 pilots still on furlough? It’s been stated in many places that American has been pulling flow through’s and recalls in. I just jump seated on a Flight recently and the CA stated he had received his recall and will not be going back.
It seems that by any calculation the company should be hiring from the street by 2012, ok you can tack on all your caveats to support or refute that.
So back to the original question, why does the quicktake still show that many furloughs when it seems the company has been recalling for quite some time?
It seems that by any calculation the company should be hiring from the street by 2012, ok you can tack on all your caveats to support or refute that.
So back to the original question, why does the quicktake still show that many furloughs when it seems the company has been recalling for quite some time?
07-15-2011 | 09:51 PM
#319
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 945
Likes: 0
Funny you mention SQL - I fly out of there now fairly often. Never been an MD80 CA, was just a lowly F100 FO during my short AA career in early 2001.
07-16-2011 | 04:19 AM
#320
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,430
Likes: 124
From: Window seat
I'm probably talking out of turn, but it is conceivable AA could bring in new hire classes by next Spring. While retiring a cetain number of 80's, they are also brining online new 73's at a modest clip. Adding planes while grounding others isn't a bad thing, right?
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
More importantly and someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't AA have more pilots over 60 than under 40? If true, retirements, especially early ones, could make hiring needed despite other actions.
Finally and while I don't think the economy is great, there has been some modest recovery in aviation travel. We've been bouncing along the bottom for a while and, thanks to various factors, airlines aren't talking about furloughs, but rather recalls and even the possibility of hiring.
I'm not an optimistic guy, but projections for new hiring aren't as crazy as they might sound.
AA has about 7x more guys over 60 vs. under 40. That's the active list and doesn't include under 40 furloughees.
So the number of under 40 guys is probably equal to the number of 62.5+ guys at AA.
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