US Airways agrees with APA

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04-23-2012, 04:55 PM

#51

cactiboss

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Joined APC: Apr 2008

Posts: 3,240

Quote:

Originally Posted by crzipilot

I do believe, either way, as it's understood, that there must be a list actually voted in before you can file. Sometime called ripeness?

Yes, the 9th says that that we have to wait until a contract is ratified before we can sue, so that kind of takes care of your presumption we would block a contract doesn't it?

04-23-2012, 05:08 PM

#52

Rookie

On Reserve

Joined APC: Jan 2012

Posts: 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by crzipilot

So on record your willing to throw away an improved contract and superior pay when compared to ANY pay scale the west has ever seen?

And that's because you know the West list is younger, and will prevail in their windfall seats for a longer period of time then the east or the AA group? I have a feeling that's why at every new twist in this history, the west guys become so frantic about the Nic.....

And though you threaten the law suit etc.... I do believe, either way, as it's understood, that there must be a list actually voted in before you can file. Sometime called ripeness?

Actually when adjusted for inflation the proposed pay rates are similar to what we got in our last contract. $142 in 2004 = $172 in 2012. The only reason our pay is low now is because of USAPA. Also, I would say that many areas of our contract are superior to those of American's. If I could take $170/hr and either our contract or American's, I would pick ours without hesitation.

04-24-2012, 05:18 AM

#53

crzipilot

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Joined APC: Jun 2010

Posts: 449

True, and I believe the 9th was stating that until the whole picture was included as to the seniority list etc, there would be no way to tell if a DFR had occured. So in essence, an APA designed list, a split between DOH and NIC, with improved contract terms etc (money) may negate any DFR that the west dreams of absent the NIC.

04-24-2012, 07:09 AM

#54

cactiboss

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Joined APC: Apr 2008

Posts: 3,240

Quote:

Originally Posted by crzipilot

The 9th was stating that their interpretation is you can't file dfr on a "proposal" because that would severely limit a union's right to bargain. Your example has some validity because they basically said there could be, "theoretically" a proposal that was better for the west than the nicolau award. What you and every other eastie don't get, is that anything "less" than the Nic. is illegal, for what reason would usapa improve the east's position while harming the west? especially in a merger where usapa's "self hostage taking" would be moot? It has been proven that usapa was formed to avoid the Nic. and that there are ton's of case history that proves the west's complaint. You guys keep thinking this stuff just evaporates into thin air.

04-24-2012, 09:34 PM

#55

Godzilla

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Joined APC: Dec 2007

Posts: 188

Quote:

Originally Posted by cactusmike

The deal would not be done between the unions and Parker if there were going to be any mainline furloughs. That was the whole point, that there is no overlap. Look at the analysis of a LCC/AA merger from Bob Herbst. There are many strengths and the only gap is Pacific routes, which would imply growth because there are no partners in that region. LCC has a boatload of Airbus widebody orders coming, as well as more narrowbodies. AA announced their fleet renewal plan earlier. With age 65 kicking in later this year there will be a need for pilots sooner rather than later.

The regional feed will be a mess to sort out. I have no clue what that will entail, we have heard nothing on that.

Really?
Did Parker not say there would be no furloughs when US and AW merged?
How many furloughs were there? How many are still furloughed?

I thought Herbst said there is an 8% overlap,not none.
How much is 8% of 12,000 pilots being excess.

I am just sayin. I do not think this proposed merger would be good for anyone who wears a uniform to work.
I have not been in a merger yet that was.

04-25-2012, 04:52 AM

#56

SkipEhr

On Reserve

Joined APC: Mar 2012

Position: Embraer 190, Captain

Posts: 16

I feel sorry for the folks at AA, Having USAirways involved in any way shape or manor is a major disadvantage. The employees are great but the management is terrible. Talk about an old school us verses them mentality. They are a dismal company with no hope of any sort of company culture.

04-25-2012, 06:26 PM

#57

cactusmike

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Joined APC: May 2005

Position: B777/CA retired

Posts: 1,483

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkipEhr

Ahh, no, can't do it. Was going to post but it is just falling on deaf ears. You are on the East side, right?

We get along very well out west with our chief pilots, our check airmen and everyone below the level of VP or Manager of something. Oh, wait, those guys are all East. Hogg, Bular, Hope, Skinner are all cut from the same cloth. Hopefully they go away along with USAPA.

04-26-2012, 04:58 AM

#58

VenetianFryCook

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Joined APC: Mar 2011

Position: A319/20/21 FO

Posts: 292

Quote:

Originally Posted by cactusmike

Don't count on that ... if this goes as Parker plans, the only thing that will change about Team Tempe is their mailing address.

I think the company has a pretty good culture overall. I'm treated pretty well by the chiefs, check airmen, etc. The previous poster seems to have a crummy outlook on life that permeates all.

Don't get me wrong - we're not all sunshine and unicorns by any stretch, but if it really was as bad as this guy claims, there'd be mass suicides every day!