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-   -   New flaw in TA scope (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/major/67769-new-flaw-ta-scope.html)

forgot to bid 05-31-2012 01:31 PM

How many 76 seaters or 50 seaters does SWA have?

rahc 05-31-2012 01:56 PM


Originally Posted by shiznit (Post 1201908)
UAL already has unlimited 70's.

DAL combined cap is 255 (lower than pre-merger DAL/NWA limit)......

All that with 25% lower pay(DAL TA will make UCAL 40% behind).

Thanks to UCAL for pulling their weight and helping raise the bar!

Who put pressure on whom?

The 70 seat is unlimited but it is tied to a ratio at mainline. I believe they are capped right now. They currently have 124 CRJ700/E170s (aka the 70 seater).

DCI has 255 large rjs. I am sure management at UAL would love the Delta scope and they would be really excited about having our TA scope.

acl65pilot 05-31-2012 04:55 PM


Originally Posted by shiznit (Post 1201908)
UAL already has unlimited 70's.

DAL combined cap is 255 (lower than pre-merger DAL/NWA limit)......

All that with 25% lower pay(DAL TA will make UCAL 40% behind).

Thanks to UCAL for pulling their weight and helping raise the bar!

Who put pressure on whom?

Ask them, I have. They have read our TA and are not happy with the scope part. Not at all. They feel it cuts them off at the knees. They are neutral on the pay.

forgot to bid 05-31-2012 05:55 PM


Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 1202132)
Ask them, I have. They have read our TA and are not happy with the scope part. Not at all. They feel it cuts them off at the knees. They are neutral on the pay.

See, FTB spreadsheet makes UAL happy.

TA makes UAL mad.

slowplay 05-31-2012 07:01 PM


Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 1201824)
Yep, we still get to be the initial accumulator in a down turn, then and only when we hit 1:59:1 does DCI reduction even become a possibility.

Last time I checked 1.19 is less than 1.56.

DCI is going to shrink with this TA and shrink a lot. Way before mainline will. And unlike FTB's bogus fleet sheet, using a real fleet plan that keeps seats in the appropriate markets means that the downside trigger of 1.56 would be hit at a fleet count between 30-40 airplanes greater than we have right now, and it will happen when DCI is 148 airplanes smaller than it is now.

What you assert as fact is incorrect.

DeadHead 05-31-2012 07:08 PM


Originally Posted by slowplay (Post 1202235)
Last time I checked 1.19 is less than 1.56.

DCI is going to shrink with this TA and shrink a lot. Way before mainline will. And unlike FTB's bogus fleet sheet, using a real fleet plan that keeps seats in the appropriate markets means that the downside trigger of 1.56 would be hit at a fleet count between 30-40 airplanes greater than we have right now, and it will happen when DCI is 148 airplanes smaller than it is now.

What you assert as fact is incorrect.

Slow,

Question....
What happens if the company does not honor it's side of the agreement, and keep the ratios within contractual limits?
(What penalties are outlined in the TA against the company)

Columbia 05-31-2012 07:15 PM


Originally Posted by DeadHead (Post 1202243)
Slow,

Question....
What happens if the company does not honor it's side of the agreement, and keep the ratios within contractual limits?
(What penalties are outlined in the TA against the company)

This outta be good. Getting popcorn........

More Bacon 05-31-2012 07:20 PM


Originally Posted by DeadHead (Post 1202243)
Slow,

Question....
What happens if the company does not honor it's side of the agreement, and keep the ratios within contractual limits?
(What penalties are outlined in the TA against the company)

cue the crickets...

...or possibly a series of condescending non-sequiturs and inane obfuscation without any answer to your question whatsoever.

slowplay 05-31-2012 07:28 PM


Originally Posted by DeadHead (Post 1202243)
Slow,

Question....
What happens if the company does not honor it's side of the agreement, and keep the ratios within contractual limits?
(What penalties are outlined in the TA against the company)

There are no penalties outlined in the TA against the company. Putting penalties in that agreement presupposes that they could violate the contract and it would be "ok", that there were penalties agreed to for violating it. It's akin to asking "what penalties are in the agreement if the company doesn't pay us." Also, if management isn't abiding by the agreement in the ratios, why would they abide by the agreed upon penalties?

Disputes like you describe are resolved in 2 places, the grievance process and the court system.

More Bacon 05-31-2012 07:32 PM


Originally Posted by slowplay (Post 1202259)

Disputes like you describe are resolved in 2 places, the grievance process and the court system.

Or we could wait for c2015, and concede what DALPA is too lazy or inept to enforce.
Kind of like this time, with the RAH cutout and DPJ giveaway.


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