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-   -   TA 2012 Contract Highlights (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/major/68166-ta-2012-contract-highlights.html)

johnso29 06-18-2012 01:17 PM


Originally Posted by DLpilot (Post 1214410)
There is nothing in the TA requiring them to purchase that many. Keywords "if" and "up to".

They CAN'T get the 70 additional 76 seaters UNTIL they get the B717's/A319's. The ratio requires MORE mainline jets to be purchased then RJs.

If you want to vote NO because you don't want to give up more RJs then fine, but quit grasping at straws.

finis72 06-18-2012 01:50 PM


Originally Posted by Carl Spackler (Post 1214485)
It doesn't and alfaromeo knows it. The TA does not mandate the purchase, lease or acquisition of even one 717 much less 88 of them. Alfa is an unelected MEC bureaucrat that continually lies to us even though it's easily proven that he's lying. He just doesn't care. He's so convinced his job as an MEC admin is secure, he is simply not concerned about lying.

Carl

Pot meet kettle. As usual you twist the truth, 717's are not mandated BUT no new 76 seaters until the 717's start arriving.

TenYearsGone 06-18-2012 01:54 PM


Originally Posted by finis72 (Post 1214550)
Pot meet kettle. As usual you twist the truth, 717's are not mandated BUT no new 76 seaters until the 717's start arriving.

Finis,

What happens when they want to put 82 seats in the 76 seater? or even worst 90 seats? What happens after they get the 717s and they decide to park old 757, A320s, 747s etc?

Please think about the long term. If you vote this TA down, you are still going to get paid. You are still going to pick up GS. You are still able to make that 19% up.

After taxes, how much is that 19% anyway? Is it worth the potential for Scope degradation?

One Group,

TEN

finis72 06-18-2012 02:39 PM


Originally Posted by TenYearsGone (Post 1214552)
Finis,

What happens when they want to put 82 seats in the 76 seater? or even worst 90 seats? What happens after they get the 717s and they decide to park old 757, A320s, 747s etc?

Please think about the long term. If you vote this TA down, you are still going to get paid. You are still going to pick up GS. You are still able to make that 19% up.

After taxes, how much is that 19% anyway? Is it worth the potential for Scope degradation?

One Group,

TEN

Again long term I think this TA is an improvement in scope, we can agree to disagree on that. You can play the what if game from both sides, we have a contract that does not allow anymore than 76 seaters, period ! What if Europe tanks, what if we get hit by a meteorite then you will never make up the lost income from this TA. Let's deal with current facts. You don't like the section 1 of this TA, I got it, no what if's.

rvr350 06-18-2012 03:31 PM


Originally Posted by finis72 (Post 1214569)
Again long term I think this TA is an improvement in scope, we can agree to disagree on that. You can play the what if game from both sides, we have a contract that does not allow anymore than 76 seaters, period ! What if Europe tanks, what if we get hit by a meteorite then you will never make up the lost income from this TA. Let's deal with current facts. You don't like the section 1 of this TA, I got it, no what if's.

First of all, DALPA should not use any mention of caps on DCI, especially in BOLD font in 2015, presumably, because they fail that promise. Second of all, how are we "capping" 76 seaters? Maybe i need to reread the definition of the word, but last i checked, there will be 70 NEW LARGE GAUGE RJ not flown by DL pilots. They will be entered into looooong term lease, probably much longer terms than 717. So how does it put us at an advantage in the long term? Do you think the company isnt gonna borrow from the playbook and ask us for scope trade for a few shiny nickels?

shiznit 06-18-2012 04:45 PM


Originally Posted by rvr350 (Post 1214596)
First of all, DALPA should not use any mention of caps on DCI, especially in BOLD font in 2015, presumably, because they fail that promise. Second of all, how are we "capping" 76 seaters? Maybe i need to reread the definition of the word, but last i checked, there will be 70 NEW LARGE GAUGE RJ not flown by DL pilots. They will be entered into looooong term lease, probably much longer terms than 717. So how does it put us at an advantage in the long term? Do you think the company isnt gonna borrow from the playbook and ask us for scope trade for a few shiny nickels?

Who says they will be in long term leases?

Long term leases are what got DAL in trouble with RJ's in the first place!

FL370 06-18-2012 05:14 PM


Originally Posted by shiznit (Post 1214653)
Who says they will be in long term leases?

Long term leases are what got DAL in trouble with RJ's in the first place!

I take it you think bankers are stupid.

Nosmo King 06-18-2012 06:03 PM

Just a minor annoyance if management has to keep 50 seat RJs - can't claim that the entire system is equipped with Economy Comfort. Won't stop them from making the claim about mainline.

acl65pilot 06-18-2012 06:07 PM


Originally Posted by shiznit (Post 1214653)
Who says they will be in long term leases?

Long term leases are what got DAL in trouble with RJ's in the first place!

Does the TA say that the leases or the CPA's will have any sort of duration? Aka anythingn to stop it?

Carl Spackler 06-18-2012 06:29 PM


Originally Posted by finis72 (Post 1214550)

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler (Post 1214485)
It doesn't and alfaromeo knows it. The TA does not mandate the purchase, lease or acquisition of even one 717 much less 88 of them. Alfa is an unelected MEC bureaucrat that continually lies to us even though it's easily proven that he's lying. He just doesn't care. He's so convinced his job as an MEC admin is secure, he is simply not concerned about lying.

Pot meet kettle. As usual you twist the truth, 717's are not mandated BUT no new 76 seaters until the 717's start arriving.

You know finis, you so blindly attack anything that upsets your little house of cards built upon the foundation of DALPA, you don't even bother to read people's posts. Here's the post where you said I "twisted the truth".


Originally Posted by alfaromeo (Post 1213113)
The agreement removes a massive amount of DCI capacity that allows these aircraft to be added. The 88 717's are mandated by the TA. Got it yet?

I do NOT twist the truth. I post the actual words of people and in complete context. The problem that you, slowplay and alfaromeo have is that I repost your actual words. If you don't like your own words, then edit them.

Carl


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