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Old 02-19-2007 | 09:37 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by 1Seat 1Engine
For those of you who want to debunk these numbers with anecdotal stories of, "I once knew a CFI who had to live off of dog food, therfor these numbers can't be right" etc: I would trust the BLS's methodology a little more than the anecdotal method.

In fact, if you look around on their website you can find a lot more about what they think and they seem pretty smart on the subject. The BLS mentions several times that there are wide disparities between what pilots are paid for smaller airplanes and what senior pilots are paid for larger airplanes. Their numbers also include flight engineers, who aren't notoriously well paid. They repeatedly say that senior pilots for large airlines are "among the highest paid workers in America."

Since 50% of values fall below and above the median, even if you were paid ZERO for flying, we know that the potential income of Captains for UPS/FedEx/most legacies and even SWA is well upwards of $300. So the max is value is somewhere between two and three times the median in this case.

Think of it this way: If you plot the values on a graph (income on the bottom or x axis and number of pilots paid that income on the left or y axis), the area contained underneath the plot must be equal both left and right of the median. The left edge of the graph can't go below zero but the right edge can go up to $400k or whatever the best paid pilot in the US made. The fact that the right edge of the plot can tail off into very high numbers (3x the median) guarantees that the mean would be higher than the median.

Consider that you could conceivably take the top 5 paid airline pilots, triple their pay and ONLY THE MEAN would increase, the median value would remain the same.

The bottom line is, I believe their median numbers are correct and I believe the mean would be greater than the median.

And no I didn't sleep in a holiday in express but I do have a degree in Accounting.

And some of you guys should drag out your community college stats textbooks before you start issuing guarantees or asking what world we're in.
At least somebody offered some real insight into this study, everyone else just offered their opinion. Thanks 1 seat. I was unclear on the difference between median and mean. I do know that means are never real good at giving the picture but it sounds like medians do.
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Old 02-19-2007 | 09:57 AM
  #32  
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Cannot always put stock in Gummint numbers, but they do have those tax returns, check out Table 2 at:

http://www.bls.gov/oco/cg/pdf/cgs016.pdf



Another interesting tabular method of displaying data is in:

http://www.bls.gov/opub/cwc/tables/cm20051121ar01t1.htm

Physician’s stats undoubtedly include interns/residents -
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Old 02-19-2007 | 01:39 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Skygirl
I think Vagabond may be on to something with her Alaska pilots.
All the ones I meet are cool guys, at least the ones on here are.
Actually SG you might be attracted to them because they are socialist. Where are you Mike734? Oh, and please watch those comments about Texas! Then again I forgot I was one of those in the 15 percent according to Mike. So what do I know?
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Old 02-19-2007 | 02:07 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by 1Seat 1Engine
How'd you do in stats?

By my estimation:

The LOWEST paid pilots make maybe 100k less than the median (only 35k).

The HIGHEST paid pilots make more than 165k more than the median (>$300k although we've all heard of the workaholics who make more like $400k).

Since there's an equal number above and below the median number, you want to revise your "guarantee" of the median?
How's you do in stats???...and your estimation is wrong. There are way more pilot's making below the median therefore proving your estimation wrong. You method would only be right if you took the top paid and the lowest paid and averaged them out. Sorry
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Old 02-19-2007 | 02:08 PM
  #35  
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nice article, but someone is smoking CRACK!
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Old 02-19-2007 | 02:27 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Window_Seat
How's you do in stats???...and your estimation is wrong. There are way more pilot's making below the median therefore proving your estimation wrong. You method would only be right if you took the top paid and the lowest paid and averaged them out. Sorry
Hey dropout: definition of median follows. Read slowly:

"The median of a population is the point that divides the distribution of scores in half. Numerically, half of the scores in a population will have values that are equal to or larger than the median and half will have values that are equal to or smaller than the median."

Your spelling/grammar needs work too.

I'm gonna guess that your income is below the median, since your education clearly is.

Last edited by 1Seat 1Engine; 02-19-2007 at 02:36 PM.
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Old 02-19-2007 | 02:31 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by A330Checkairman

nice article, but someone is smoking CRACK!
Skywest has only 2500 pilots. Fedex has twice that.
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Old 02-19-2007 | 02:34 PM
  #38  
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Just considering the "Legacy" carriers, the mean salary is $119.83/hour. Multiply that by 1,000 hours (which few actually fly per year) and that is $119,830. Add a few benefits and subtract a few expenses, it probably comes out about right. You can take this out as far as you want by adding FedEx and UPS or AirTran, Alaska, JetBlue, etc., etc. I think you would see a drastic lowering of the salary if you begin to add regional and commuters into the mix.
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Old 02-19-2007 | 03:05 PM
  #39  
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Default f-16 fdx fighter guy single seat me myself and I guy

you are right there f-16 man

forgive the personal jab above.....

Last edited by A330Checkairman; 02-19-2007 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 02-19-2007 | 03:14 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Boneman
Just considering the "Legacy" carriers, the mean salary is $119.83/hour. Multiply that by 1,000 hours (which few actually fly per year) and that is $119,830. Add a few benefits and subtract a few expenses, it probably comes out about right. You can take this out as far as you want by adding FedEx and UPS or AirTran, Alaska, JetBlue, etc., etc. I think you would see a drastic lowering of the salary if you begin to add regional and commuters into the mix.
Not that simple. When you figured the mean salary of the "Legacy" carriers, did you just average their pay charts? You need to take into account that for all the Legacies except CAL, the bottom 6-7 years don't matter since no one's been hired since then. I'd guess that for American, half the guys still working have maxed out the paychart at 12 years or greater. You could make the bottom of the paychart $5 an hour for all the legacies for the first five years and it wouldn't change anyone's actual pay.

Also, I'd have little faith in the "hourly pay x 1000" method of determining pay. I know that for SWA that doesn't work for most of the guys I know.

Additionally the BLS numbers do not take into account any bonus or profit sharing.
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