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Old 04-15-2008, 02:56 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by nwa757dtw View Post
the nwa mec is going to oppose the proposed merger by all legal means possible. as a 12 year line pilot, i support their decision, up to an including a strike. nwa has the most cash in the industry. the bottom line is dal is running out of cash....
So you would rather strike and damage the NWA side of the fence during a time when airlines are in a more fragile state than usual. I'm sure NWA has a truckload of money, and it seems some of your pilots would rather drain those funds trying to prove a point by fighting this merger.

If only some of those NWA pilots spent as much time trying to negotiate a fair, decent contract, for both pilot groups, as they do trying to figure out who was the last person to screw them, then maybe we all would be one pilot group by now. We did not throw anybody under the bus, NWA pilots still have everything they had before the merger. Their seniority, contract, and pay have not been touched.

Like it or not this merger was going to happen one way or another, and if NWA or DAL pilots really think they could have stopped the merger from happening then those individuals are further from reality then they realize. Your seniority was never for sale, so it still stands and you have that until your represenatitives realize they will need to give a little to get a little.

As a side-note, we may not want to start throwing around who has the debt and who has the money because that type of attitude will divide this pilot group and company. We are a merged company now, our strengths and weakness are equal to one another.
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Old 04-15-2008, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by DeadHead View Post
... and if NWA or DAL pilots really think they could have stopped the merger from happening then those individuals are further from reality then they realize.
It's that old joke...

What's the difference between God and a pilot?

-- God doesn't think he's a pilot.


I think everyone needs to take a deep breath, count to 10, and in an inside voice, repeat after me:

"God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference."


Folks, like it or not, this thing is apparently happening. We don't run this company, and we certainly don't hold the cards. I don't get the impression that anyone is thrilled about this.

But we have two choices: Accept it, and work together to make a bad situation the best we possibly can... Or, we can cut off our noses to spite our face and then stare in the mirror 5 years from now and blame each other for how ugly we look with no nose.

Your choice.
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Old 04-15-2008, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by nwa757dtw View Post
the nwa mec is going to oppose the proposed merger by all legal means possible. as a 12 year line pilot, i support their decision, up to an including a strike. nwa has the most cash in the industry. the bottom line is dal is running out of cash....
So you would rather shut down your company and risk unemployment in an uncertain era, then be with a secure company with a truly global reach and power? And, read the above posts by DALPA. This is an interim agreement upon which the joint contract will be based off of. Also, we don't get anything until it receives the DOJ and shareholders blessings. So my pay is today as it was yesterday.
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:33 PM
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I only hope that what nwa757dtw wrote represents a very small minority in the pilot group.
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by rvr350 View Post
I only hope that what nwa757dtw wrote represents a very small minority in the pilot group.
Don't think so. Perhaps inviting them to the exclusive contract party you fellas had with Anderson might have been a step in the right direction?
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by nwa757dtw View Post
the nwa mec is going to oppose the proposed merger by all legal means possible. as a 12 year line pilot, i support their decision, up to an including a strike. nwa has the most cash in the industry. the bottom line is dal is running out of cash....
Do you really blame them for this move? DAL ALPA cozy's up with management to get an exclusive 4 year deal that completely excludes their supposed brothers at NWA.

Some of you guys are saying this thing is only an interim contract. Then why is it listed as a 4 year agreement with such meager improvements?
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:44 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by 757Driver View Post
Don't think so. Perhaps inviting them to the exclusive contract party you fellas had with Anderson might have been a step in the right direction?
It's an LOA...

Did you even read the rest of the thread before you started pontificating?



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Old 04-15-2008, 04:50 PM
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Originally Posted by 757Driver View Post
Do you really blame them for this move? DAL ALPA cozy's up with management to get an exclusive 4 year deal that completely excludes their supposed brothers at NWA.

Some of you guys are saying this thing is only an interim contract. Then why is it listed as a 4 year agreement with such meager improvements?

From the Delta MEC:



For the last several months, the goal of the Delta MEC was to achieve a comprehensive agreement which would have included a transition agreement, a joint pilot contract and an integrated seniority list. Unfortunately, we were unable to reach an agreement on seniority list integration with the Northwest MEC, which was a crucial part of the overall package.

Instead, we were able to negotiate Letter 19 which sets a “higher bar” for an eventual joint contract than would have otherwise existed without Letter 19. That is good for all pilots of the merged corporation. We still are actively encouraging three way talks between Delta and both pilot groups to achieve many of the same goals, including harmonization of our contracts to include these critical improvements.

Northwest’s contract specifies that if their carrier is acquired by another carrier, then their PWA remains in full effect for them until the Northwest MEC negotiates changes. We have to respect the independence of the Northwest pilots and their MEC to establish their own strategic plan.

The Delta MEC considers the combined Northwest and Delta pilot groups to be one group now and our every action will reflect that belief. We chose a course of action that we felt provided the most value to ALL Delta pilots including our brothers and sisters from Northwest. We will put the full power of the Delta MEC and the Delta pilots behind our efforts to achieve contract harmonization for Northwest pilots in a short period of time, and make will every effort to achieve a mutually agreeable solution on seniority list integration.

The two MECs have the option to form a joint negotiating committee at any time and ask the company to negotiate a joint contract. We have already worked through many of the items necessary to bring the Northwest pilots over to our working agreement, so we anticipate that much of the negotiation will focus on the economics of the deal. Both our PWA and the Northwest pilot’s PWA, stipulate that there can not be an integrated seniority list and full operational integration until we have a new joint contract. The economic benefits of this integration is are an incentive to Delta to achieve a joint contract.

We will aggressively pursue an SLI and this can be achieved at any time. As we have said, there are economic benefits to Delta and both pilot groups to have this happen as soon as possible. Our desire is to work together with the Northwest pilots to achieve these benefits as soon as possible.

If we are unable to achieve a consensual SLI, the ALPA Executive Council may declare a Policy Initiation Date (PID) which will start the clock on the ALPA Merger Policy. There will be a more detailed discussion of the mechanics of this policy in the future, but the basic process is Seniority List Verification, Negotiation, Mediated Negotiation, and finally, Arbitration.



Does it make sense to you now?

Everything you said in your above quoted statement is flat wrong!



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Old 04-15-2008, 05:20 PM
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I wouldn't even respond to him, staplegun, because all 757drvr wants to do is to show how mighty his airline is, and how lowly we are.

That's alright, when the time comes, I will still wear my uniform and my hat proudly to walk side by side with my brothers/sisters from CAL.
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Old 04-15-2008, 05:23 PM
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Well as a 13 year NWA 320 FO here is my take on what has transpired. DAL needed contractual changes from their pilots. The DALPA negoitiated a LOA that improves the working conditions for its pilots. It also was able to extract a stake in the company, the way I see it is good for them! NWA didn't have the language that DAL had and so they were the ones who had a dog in that hunt. I personally think that if the shoes had been reversed NWA APLA would have done the same thing (or I would like to hope). I do not feel like DALPA went behind the NWA guys backs as they were the ones with a contract that needed changed in order to continue. I also feel that anything the DALPA got will eventually flow for the NWA pilots. So I see this as a plus not a negative. I would have loved for both sides to have come together and closed the differences 6 weeks ago but at least there was some gain on the working conditions we will all be under shortly.

Now that the merger is announced it is time for the DALPA and NWA ALPA to get back together and come to an agreement that benefits the entire pilot group as a whole. There are always going to be guys who feel screwed but hopefully the final product will benefit us all. Arbitration is never a good thing so hopefully it will not go down that path.
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