Delta and Alaska
01-07-2010, 11:34 AM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Posts: 593
Originally Posted by Wasatch Phantom
I think you would stovepipe the DAL list and start integrating on a ratioed basis from there.
Here's an example with simplified numbers:
Let's day DAL has 10,000 pilots (5,000 captains, 5,000 co-pilots) and AS has 1,000 pilots (500 captains and 500 co-pilots). Of DAL's 5,000 captains, 3,500 are widebody captain positions.
Below that point DAL has 6,500 pilot positions and AS still has their 1,000. The most senior AS pilot gets number 3,501 and they are integrated in a 6.5:1 ratio from that point.
Three year fences as follows. Anyone can bid any vacancy, but no AS pilot can be displaced by a DAL pilot from a pre-merger AS category, and similarly no DAL pilot can be displaced from a pre-merger DAL category by a AS pilot.
Here's an example with simplified numbers:
Let's day DAL has 10,000 pilots (5,000 captains, 5,000 co-pilots) and AS has 1,000 pilots (500 captains and 500 co-pilots). Of DAL's 5,000 captains, 3,500 are widebody captain positions.
Below that point DAL has 6,500 pilot positions and AS still has their 1,000. The most senior AS pilot gets number 3,501 and they are integrated in a 6.5:1 ratio from that point.
Three year fences as follows. Anyone can bid any vacancy, but no AS pilot can be displaced by a DAL pilot from a pre-merger AS category, and similarly no DAL pilot can be displaced from a pre-merger DAL category by a AS pilot.
Nicolau solved this issue by putting both the wide bodied captain and wide bodied first officer positions at the top of the list. His rationale was that it would account for wide bodied expectations and diffetentials in longevity to include the number of wide bodied first officer positions at the top of the list.
Not sure if that would work in this instance, but I would expect wide bodied captain positions on top, as you suggest, plus an "x" factor for wide bodied expectations and wide bodied first officers along with some moderate fences/protections.
01-07-2010, 11:51 AM
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: On the aluminum Arctic snow sled
Posts: 127
Originally Posted by forgot to bid
*As to the furloughed pilots, just put them back in and bring them on. If worst case there really is no room for them currently in AK then put them outside any fences and just in the DAL system, i.e. DAL equipment and bases.
--One of the 106
01-07-2010, 12:03 PM
#53
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Bob Marley on the tail
Posts: 36
LOL...
Expectations? These are mine based on what a enjoy now and what I expect in the future.
Language that protect A plan benefit. It has a $2M actuarial benefit: $1M LS + $6k per month.
Continue to contribute 11% to 401k.
Top to bottom DOH SLI.
You can keep WB. Not interested.
I want to continue to enjoy turns and 2-day trips.
Not asking for too much, am I?
Expectations? These are mine based on what a enjoy now and what I expect in the future.
Language that protect A plan benefit. It has a $2M actuarial benefit: $1M LS + $6k per month.
Continue to contribute 11% to 401k.
Top to bottom DOH SLI.
You can keep WB. Not interested.
I want to continue to enjoy turns and 2-day trips.
Not asking for too much, am I?
01-07-2010, 12:15 PM
#54
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by stix'nstrings
LOL...
Expectations? These are mine based on what a enjoy now and what I expect in the future.
Language that protect A plan benefit. It has a $2M actuarial benefit: $1M LS + $6k per month.
Continue to contribute 11% to 401k.
Top to bottom DOH SLI.
You can keep WB. Not interested.
I want to continue to enjoy turns and 2-day trips.
Not asking for too much, am I?
Expectations? These are mine based on what a enjoy now and what I expect in the future.
Language that protect A plan benefit. It has a $2M actuarial benefit: $1M LS + $6k per month.
Continue to contribute 11% to 401k.
Top to bottom DOH SLI.
You can keep WB. Not interested.
I want to continue to enjoy turns and 2-day trips.
Not asking for too much, am I?
Sounds good... don't expect DOH unless you want to be dissapointed. That ship has sailed. Just trying to be realistic.
edit: FYI, we do a very large amount of turns and 2 day trips on the domestic side of operations.
Last edited by 80ktsClamp; 01-07-2010 at 12:27 PM.
01-07-2010, 12:35 PM
#55
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Bob Marley on the tail
Posts: 36
Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
Sounds good... don't expect DOH unless you want to be dissapointed. That ship has sailed. Just trying to be realistic.
It may not be for everybody, but I (and I think I speak for most) don't want a merger 
.Let's see if this fictional rumor has legs in the coming weeks; still doubtful. If it does than we will undoubtably see 12,000 different items and concerns for an SLI. In the end, nobody will be happy with results except senior VP's, boardmembers and a few stakeholders.
01-07-2010, 02:45 PM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: LAX ERA
Posts: 3,457
Originally Posted by forgot to bid
*As to the furloughed pilots, just put them back in and bring them on. If worst case there really is no room for them currently in AK then put them outside any fences and just in the DAL system, i.e. DAL equipment and bases.
Nu or someone may want to correct my memory here
Ferd
Last edited by vagabond; 01-07-2010 at 06:29 PM. Reason: fixed typo ;)
01-07-2010, 02:55 PM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: LAX ERA
Posts: 3,457
Originally Posted by stix'nstrings
Understand. My bullets were simply a quicktake picture to convey QOL, expectations and earnings for someone like myself is who content with status quo at Alaska. It may not be for everybody, but I (and I think I speak for most) don't want a merger .
Let's see if this fictional rumor has legs in the coming weeks; still doubtful. If it does than we will undoubtably see 12,000 different items and concerns for an SLI. In the end, nobody will be happy with results except senior VP's, boardmembers and a few stakeholders.
Let's see if this fictional rumor has legs in the coming weeks; still doubtful. If it does than we will undoubtably see 12,000 different items and concerns for an SLI. In the end, nobody will be happy with results except senior VP's, boardmembers and a few stakeholders.
If it happens, which I for one hope it doesn't, you're in for a wild ride
But, I'll tell ya, we're a great group of guys....both on here and on the line. I haven't met a "southie" I haven't liked yet and the debate on APC while the SLI was going on was intense but polite.Good luck to us all, in the words of Jimmy Buffet........"I keep hang'en on as this old world keeps turn'en, and it's good to know it's out of my control"
Ferd
01-07-2010, 03:18 PM
#58
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,839
01-07-2010, 04:40 PM
#59
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by Ferd149
If I understand what you're proposing, there is president for this. On the NWA side, there were green new hires who hadn't started yet or were in training that Republic no longer needed. They were kept and actually included in the red numbers and quotas. However, if I remember the stories correctly, they were not real popular on the green side.
Nu or someone may want to correct my memory here
Ferd
Nu or someone may want to correct my memory here
Ferd
Those were the "watermelons" right?
01-08-2010, 04:49 AM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 581
FTB,
Wasatch is the name of the mountain range that runs north-south just east of Salt Lake City.
The word itself is an Indian word and means something like "low point in a high mountain" which sounds like a "pass" to me.
Wasatch is the name of the mountain range that runs north-south just east of Salt Lake City.
The word itself is an Indian word and means something like "low point in a high mountain" which sounds like a "pass" to me.
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