CAL Board to meet Wed. about merger 4/28
04-29-2010, 12:34 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 230
Socal,
Good luck to all of us is correct. If this merge does happen, we need to come together, and focus on a joint contract that will benefit all of us well into the future. It won't be easy. I'm certain there will be posturing on both sides regarding sli.
Regarding uniforms, Glenn Tilton has seen fit to have a fashion designer put us new threads next year. They can spend money on new uniforms but not a contract. I'd be happy to wear flip flops, bermuda shorts, and a tommy bahama shirt.
Good luck to all of us is correct. If this merge does happen, we need to come together, and focus on a joint contract that will benefit all of us well into the future. It won't be easy. I'm certain there will be posturing on both sides regarding sli.
Regarding uniforms, Glenn Tilton has seen fit to have a fashion designer put us new threads next year. They can spend money on new uniforms but not a contract. I'd be happy to wear flip flops, bermuda shorts, and a tommy bahama shirt.
04-29-2010, 02:34 PM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: 18%er but I’ll enforce UPA23 to the last period.
Posts: 439
Originally Posted by Fritzthepilot
I'd be happy to wear flip flops, bermuda shorts, and a tommy bahama shirt.
04-29-2010, 02:40 PM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,002
Originally Posted by SoCalGuy
I have got 3+ emails with a PDF of a "RUMORED".....and again RUMORED....SLI in the works. It's basically SLI of Relative Senority top to bottom.
There are 2 versions.....RS with both lists using pilots ON PROPERY from CAL/UAL......the other using RS of ALL Pilots (Furlough & Active) from both carriers as well.
The list have been laided out with DOH/DOB/Percentage overall/....they also have a colum that shows how your % is affected in the RS SLI set up. ALL info shows slotts with DOH and DOB, so you can see right where you would sit in this particular model. The notes in the email along with this PDF file say it looks similar to DELTAs merged list.....have not much knowledge on theirs, but from the powers to be, that's how it's been compared. AGAIN....just a MODEL that has been constructed.
Interesting to say the least.
CAL MEC meets with Mike Boyd this week for a two day meeting....I'm sure this will be one of the topics in the 'war-room'
Good luck to all of US.
There are 2 versions.....RS with both lists using pilots ON PROPERY from CAL/UAL......the other using RS of ALL Pilots (Furlough & Active) from both carriers as well.
The list have been laided out with DOH/DOB/Percentage overall/....they also have a colum that shows how your % is affected in the RS SLI set up. ALL info shows slotts with DOH and DOB, so you can see right where you would sit in this particular model. The notes in the email along with this PDF file say it looks similar to DELTAs merged list.....have not much knowledge on theirs, but from the powers to be, that's how it's been compared. AGAIN....just a MODEL that has been constructed.
Interesting to say the least.
CAL MEC meets with Mike Boyd this week for a two day meeting....I'm sure this will be one of the topics in the 'war-room'
Good luck to all of US.
04-29-2010, 02:56 PM
#35
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
Originally Posted by 757Driver
Any chance we can keep our uniforms?
The blue with silver sleeved piping just doesn't sit well with me.
The blue with silver sleeved piping just doesn't sit well with me.
04-29-2010, 02:57 PM
#36
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Cute 9;
Lets leave the perceptions of what happened here in the past. Both sides vote on anything. Remember that.
Our turn in the spotlight is over. It is CAL/UAUA's time to deal with all of the fun stuff.
Lets leave the perceptions of what happened here in the past. Both sides vote on anything. Remember that.
Our turn in the spotlight is over. It is CAL/UAUA's time to deal with all of the fun stuff.
04-29-2010, 03:02 PM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 230
Originally Posted by DC9Driver
Time to pull up a chair and watch the fireworks.
For all of you CAL guys. Here are a few things you can expect from the UAL pilots, seeing as how they are far superior (like the Delta pilots), and they think they are saving your a$$
1) Expect a minimal show of negotiators on Day 1 of the SLI negotiations. This is to give everyone involved the false impression that there is nothing to worry about. United merger negotiators will also go to their constituents and tell them about all the CAL negotiators that showed up and accuse all CAL pilots of being overly-protective.
2) Expect UAL pilots to negotiate their own contract before the SLI negotiations have been completed. Excuse? You darn CAL guys just weren't playing ball and time is off the essence. The only problem being there are nuggets in the new contract that are specifically harmful to you CAL pilots. (ie... they will negotiate , by themselves, pay raises and a few highly-publicized items, but in the end, UAL pilots will dictate terms. Why? Because they are bigger, smarter and they are saving your a$$.) Particularly onerous will be the fact that the A320 rates will be higher than the 737 rates you have..heck it's a far-more complicated airplane to fly than the 737. "We don't care if your 737 has more seats and payload."
3) Expect ALPA National to do NOTHING, I mean N-O-T-H-I-N-G, to help CAL pilots. UAL is bigger, and gosh darn it, we don't want to do anything to disenfranchise UAL pilots. (ie...There is an ALPA merger policy...your union dollars were spent on gathering lawyers that came up with a merger policy should one ever occur between ALPA carriers. The problem is, that policy will never be used because ALPA neither has the BALLS or the fortitude to take a stance on a controversial SLI negotiation. You will go to binding arbitration because ALPA will not envoke the PID (Policy Implementation Date)...it's just too risky for the ALPA National blood suckers.
4) UAL pilots will protect that 744 like it a golden egg. Expect multiple-year fences. For the 777 captains at CAL...don't even think you compare to their super-premium wide body flying skills--don't even THINK about it.
5) CAL pilots will be wearing the uniform of the United pilots...even if it is a new one designed by some faggy New York firm that was paid millions of dollars to design it. Sorry, it's just the way it is when you are bigger, smarter and remember they are saving your a$$.
6) More to come later I am sure...if anyone else wants to place their predictions on the SLI negotiations, please do so.
Please accept my apologies for all of the TIC remarks. Northwest pilots have been through it all before. When you want leadership, you will not get it if you are CAL pilot. Always remember, that it is the job of UAL negotiators to make you feel inferior and substandard. Try not to take it too personally. It is just the way it is done in this industry now. If you aren't the biggest, and you don't bring in the greater portion of money at ALPA, you aren't going to win the big battles.
Best of luck to everyone involved. This isn't a slam on any UAL pilot. Heck, most UAL pilots are just trying to make a living and deal with a substandard pilot contract, just like the CAL people are...just like the rest of us are. But make no mistake, UAL is going to assert themselves EARLY and AGGRESSIVELY. No matter how hard CAL wants to negotiate, NO will be the answer and this thing is going to arbitration.
Believe me, we (NW/DAL) wrote the book.
For all of you CAL guys. Here are a few things you can expect from the UAL pilots, seeing as how they are far superior (like the Delta pilots), and they think they are saving your a$$
1) Expect a minimal show of negotiators on Day 1 of the SLI negotiations. This is to give everyone involved the false impression that there is nothing to worry about. United merger negotiators will also go to their constituents and tell them about all the CAL negotiators that showed up and accuse all CAL pilots of being overly-protective.
2) Expect UAL pilots to negotiate their own contract before the SLI negotiations have been completed. Excuse? You darn CAL guys just weren't playing ball and time is off the essence. The only problem being there are nuggets in the new contract that are specifically harmful to you CAL pilots. (ie... they will negotiate , by themselves, pay raises and a few highly-publicized items, but in the end, UAL pilots will dictate terms. Why? Because they are bigger, smarter and they are saving your a$$.) Particularly onerous will be the fact that the A320 rates will be higher than the 737 rates you have..heck it's a far-more complicated airplane to fly than the 737. "We don't care if your 737 has more seats and payload."
3) Expect ALPA National to do NOTHING, I mean N-O-T-H-I-N-G, to help CAL pilots. UAL is bigger, and gosh darn it, we don't want to do anything to disenfranchise UAL pilots. (ie...There is an ALPA merger policy...your union dollars were spent on gathering lawyers that came up with a merger policy should one ever occur between ALPA carriers. The problem is, that policy will never be used because ALPA neither has the BALLS or the fortitude to take a stance on a controversial SLI negotiation. You will go to binding arbitration because ALPA will not envoke the PID (Policy Implementation Date)...it's just too risky for the ALPA National blood suckers.
4) UAL pilots will protect that 744 like it a golden egg. Expect multiple-year fences. For the 777 captains at CAL...don't even think you compare to their super-premium wide body flying skills--don't even THINK about it.
5) CAL pilots will be wearing the uniform of the United pilots...even if it is a new one designed by some faggy New York firm that was paid millions of dollars to design it. Sorry, it's just the way it is when you are bigger, smarter and remember they are saving your a$$.
6) More to come later I am sure...if anyone else wants to place their predictions on the SLI negotiations, please do so.
Please accept my apologies for all of the TIC remarks. Northwest pilots have been through it all before. When you want leadership, you will not get it if you are CAL pilot. Always remember, that it is the job of UAL negotiators to make you feel inferior and substandard. Try not to take it too personally. It is just the way it is done in this industry now. If you aren't the biggest, and you don't bring in the greater portion of money at ALPA, you aren't going to win the big battles.
Best of luck to everyone involved. This isn't a slam on any UAL pilot. Heck, most UAL pilots are just trying to make a living and deal with a substandard pilot contract, just like the CAL people are...just like the rest of us are. But make no mistake, UAL is going to assert themselves EARLY and AGGRESSIVELY. No matter how hard CAL wants to negotiate, NO will be the answer and this thing is going to arbitration.
Believe me, we (NW/DAL) wrote the book.
04-29-2010, 03:05 PM
#39
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: A320 Cap
Posts: 2,282
DC9Driver,
I don't have any idea how the negotiations will go, and like you said, I'm just trying to earn a living over here. I don't think you will find ONE United guy that thinks they are "saving CAL's a$$". I know I don't. At the end of the day, Im not expecting to roll into CAL with DOH, because that isn't reasonable. I'm also not expecting to lose my Captains seat to someone who was hired 10 years after me because THAT'S not reasonable either. It will be what it will be. My guess is that IF a merger should go through, we'd like to negotiate from the strongest sections of both contracts.
Please don't go firing up folks about what's "going to be" when none of us have any clue how its "going to be". You may not like how your merger turned out, but it looks a HECK of a lot better than the USAirways/Cactus one! Let's just stop speculating and wait to see what happens.
I don't have any idea how the negotiations will go, and like you said, I'm just trying to earn a living over here. I don't think you will find ONE United guy that thinks they are "saving CAL's a$$". I know I don't. At the end of the day, Im not expecting to roll into CAL with DOH, because that isn't reasonable. I'm also not expecting to lose my Captains seat to someone who was hired 10 years after me because THAT'S not reasonable either. It will be what it will be. My guess is that IF a merger should go through, we'd like to negotiate from the strongest sections of both contracts.
Please don't go firing up folks about what's "going to be" when none of us have any clue how its "going to be". You may not like how your merger turned out, but it looks a HECK of a lot better than the USAirways/Cactus one! Let's just stop speculating and wait to see what happens.
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