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Old 06-24-2017, 01:47 PM   #1  
Living the Dream
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Default Why I'm Voting No

The pilot group’s call to arms of the last two years has sounded something like “Industry Standard!” While TA17 improves on the horrible, debatably worse-than-current-book tentative agreement from 2015, it still falls very, very short of our unanimous goal of Industry Standard, let alone raising the bar. Some might want a few extra dollars before punching out, but bluntly, that’s selfish. Others have resigned themselves to the idea that “this is the best we can get.” What are the five hazardous attitudes again?

I intended to put this out sooner, but life has been busy and I wanted to give every word of our negotiators’ work its full due. Now that I have, yes, there are some improvements, but many of those improvements fall short of standard, omit critical language, or allow management plenty of loophole flexibility. Other work rules are definitively worse than current book.

Quote:
2-A-12 "Day" means a period of time from the hours of 0001 to 2400 based upon the local time of a pilot's domicile; provided, however, that a flight scheduled to terminate before 2400 but which is delayed and actually terminated at or before 0200 will not alter a pilot's scheduled day off.
This has hurt many pilots many times. You’re at min days off, you get delayed into the next day, and you even miss your commute home. Great. So you whip out your cell phone and call Crew Line Adjustments to get a different day off. “Sorry, look at 2-A-12, a day doesn’t mean a day.”

Quote:
3-A-1-b CR900/E175 (<86,000 lbs.) Captain Pay Rates

Longevity DOS DOS+1 DOS+2 DOS+3
1 $63.00 $64.50 $66.00 $67.32
2 $65.00 $66.50 $69.00 $70.38
3 $67.00 $68.50 $71.00 $72.42
4 $69.00 $70.50 $73.00 $74.46
5 $71.00 $72.50 $75.00 $76.50
6 $73.00 $75.00 $77.00 $78.54
7 $75.00 $76.50 $79.00 $80.58
8 $77.00 $79.00 $81.00 $82.62
9 $79.00 $81.00 $84.00 $85.68
10 $81.75 $83.50 $86.00 $87.72
11 $84.12 $86.00 $89.00 $90.78
12 $86.66 $88.50 $92.00 $93.84
13 $89.26 $91.25 $94.00 $95.88
14 $91.96 $94.00 $96.00 $97.92
15 $94.43 $96.50 $98.00 $99.96
16 $96.46 $98.50 $101.00 $103.02
17 $98.53 $100.51 $103.00 $105.06
18 $100.65 $102.66 $105.50 $107.61
19 $102.82 $104.88 $108.50 $110.67
20 $105.08 $107.18 $111.00 $113.22
We’ll call these the de facto rates since they’re what most of the Captains will be receiving. These rates, like all rates, continue to leave our pilot group as the lowest paid 121 jet operators in the country. This is in no conceivable way industry standard. Some comparisons:

Year – 2 – 5 – 10 – 20

Mesa – 65 – 71 – 82 – 105
Envoy – 70 – 77 – 88 – 106
SkyWest – 70 – 78 – 91 – 119
Republic – 72 – 78 – 91 – 120
Compass – 69 – 76 – 89 – 111

Quote:
3-A-1-d CR200/E145/E140/E135 Captain Pay Rates

Longevity DOS DOS+1 DOS+2 DOS+3
1 $55.93 $57.05 $57.90 $58.77
2 $57.67 $58.82 $59.71 $60.60
3 $59.41 $60.60 $61.51 $62.43
4 $61.20 $62.43 $63.36 $64.31
5 $63.01 $64.27 $65.23 $66.21
6 $64.84 $66.14 $67.13 $68.13
7 $66.61 $67.94 $68.96 $70.00
8 $68.75 $70.13 $71.18 $72.25
9 $70.86 $72.28 $73.37 $74.47
10 $73.04 $74.50 $75.62 $76.75
11 $75.15 $76.65 $77.80 $78.97
12 $77.45 $78.99 $80.18 $81.38
13 $79.74 $81.34 $82.56 $83.80
14 $82.20 $83.85 $85.11 $86.38
15 $83.85 $85.53 $86.81 $88.11
16 $85.53 $87.24 $88.54 $89.87
17 $87.24 $88.98 $90.32 $91.67
18 $88.98 $90.76 $92.12 $93.50
19 $90.76 $92.58 $93.96 $95.37
20 $92.58 $94.43 $95.84 $97.28
And God help us if we ever do more 50-seat flying.

Year – 2 – 5 – 10 – 20

Mesa – 58 – 63 – 73 – 93
TSA – 66 – 71 – 83 – 101
Envoy – 67 – 73 – 84 – 101
SkyWest – 65 – 72 – 84 – 110
Piedmont – 63 – 73 – 88 – 93
Air Whiskey – 69 – 76 – 89 – 109

In fact, our CRJ900/E175 rates are actually below the vast majority of 50-seat rates at other carriers. In what world is this considered industry standard, particularly when you consider our healthcare premiums, iPad purchases, and uniform expenses that lag behind everybody else?

Quote:
3-A-1-e First Officer Pay Rates (<86,000 lbs.)

Longevity DOS DOS+1 DOS+2 DOS+3
1 $36.00 $36.00 $31.00 $31.31
2 $38.00 $38.00 $34.00 $34.34
3 $38.00 $38.00 $36.00 $36.36
4 $38.00 $38.00 $38.00 $38.38
5 $39.00 $39.00 $39.00 $39.39
6 $41.00 $41.00 $41.00 $41.41
7 $42.00 $42.00 $42.00 $42.42
8 $43.00 $43.00 $43.00 $43.43
9 $44.00 $44.00 $44.00 $44.44
10 $45.00 $45.00 $45.00 $45.45
11 $47.00 $47.00 $47.00 $47.47
12 $49.00 $49.00 $48.00 $48.48
13 $50.00 $50.00 $50.00 $50.50
14 $51.00 $51.00 $51.00 $51.51
15 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
16 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
17 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
18 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
19 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
20 $52.00 $52.00 $52.00 $52.52
Yes, $22.18 to $36 an hour is a big jump for first year pay and about the only part of the contract that really surprised me. It’s one facet that comes close to industry standard, but it’s one small part of a giant agreement, our first year FO’s will still be the lowest paid in the industry – 50-seat jet rates included – and we’re creating a B-scale to do it.

What is a B-scale?
BOB CRANDALL'S BOO-BOOS THE FIERY AMERICAN AIRLINES CHAIRMAN FACES LABOR STRIFE THAT COULD CREATE LONG-LASTING SCARS AT HIS COMPANY. HERE'S HOW HE WENT WRONG. - April 28, 1997

“The war started back in 1983, when a growth imperative gripped major airlines as they raced to compete with low-fare startups. Crandall convinced the pilots that the airline couldn't buy planes to add routes unless new pilots could be hired at drastically reduced pay scales. It seemed like another brilliant Crandall win-win at the time. The pilots who were then at American got to keep their pay, and the new planes offered them opportunities to move more quickly from co-pilot to captain status. Meanwhile, with each new cut-rate pilot, Crandall lowered his average labor costs, all the better to finance the debt incurred in buying the new jets.

Several years later, however, this move came back to haunt him. The pilots hired at what came to be known as the ‘b-scales’ developed a sort of inferiority complex. ‘All of a sudden, there was a whole group of people working there who were extremely resentful of the fact that the person sitting next to them was making a lot more money for exactly the same job," says Larry Crawford, president of Avitas, an aviation consulting firm in Reston, Virginia. "They began to wonder what kind of scheme was coming at them next.’ …they still resented their status as second-class citizens.”


Like Frank Lorenzo’s wake of destruction or the proliferation of regional jets in the 90’s, American’s creation of the B-scale is one of the most infamous anti-pilot policies our profession has had to come back from. It hurt the career earnings of thousands and its ripple effects on the industry aren’t quantifiable.

Does any of that excerpt sound like JO or Mesa Airlines? It should. We’ve heard all the same rhetoric, and just like American Airlines, our pilot group has the power to stop it. Let’s make the right decision this time – future aviators will thank you.

THE PAY RATES IN THIS CONTRACT WOULD STILL QUANTIFIABLY LEAVE US AS THE LOWEST PAID JET OPERATORS IN THE COUNTRY. THIS ALONE WARRANTS A “NO” VOTE.

Quote:
3-D When a pilot is advanced from one pay step to the next, which occurs on the anniversary of his date of hire, he shall be paid his new rate from the beginning of the pay period nearest that date.
Every single pilot hired after the 7th or after the 22nd of the month gets screwed out of half a month of a better pay rate every single year. This really needed to be fixed.

Quote:
3-F Pilots flying on Company holidays shall receive 1.5 times the applicable rates set forth above. Company holidays are:
- New Year’s Day (Jan 1st)
- Labor Day
- Memorial Day
- Thanksgiving
- Independence Day (July 4th)
- Christmas (Dec. 25th)
We're missing Easter, and let’s be honest, Super Bowl Sunday (hey, Republic has it).

Quote:
3-H-8 Long Layover Pay Credit
For a trip pairing that has a scheduled layover(s) longer than twentyeight (28) hours, two (2) hours of pay credit shall be added to the trip pairing credit for each such layover.
It's an improvement over current book, and while pay and hotels were in dire need of fixing, so too is scheduling. We do 3.5 hour sits to do 2 hours of flying some days, and on 30-hour overnights we're not compensated for a whole day away from home. This is a baby step in the right direction but a far cry from the Min Day language we actually need.

Quote:
5-A-2-a Per Diem Amounts
DOS $1.60 plus $40/month iPad reimbursement allowance
DOS+1 $1.65 plus $40/month iPad reimbursement allowance
DOS+2 $1.70 plus $40/month iPad reimbursement allowance
DOS+3 $1.70 plus $40/month iPad reimbursement allowance
Per diem still falls below everyone else. Current rates at other non-WO shops are as follows:
Republic – $1.95 ($2.50 int’l)
ExpressJet – $1.85
SkyWest – $1.90

iPads are also provided by every other airline in the country. To sanction buying our own is to lower the bar, and the extra $40 essentially just brings the per diem rate to around $1.70 while you’re still paying for your own iPad.

Quote:
5-B-11-a When the Company enters into any contract with a hotel to provide lodging to pilots for their overnights (including split duty), overnights for training and on temporary duty assignment, that hotel contract will preferably contain all or some of the following criteria:
One word negates and invalidates this entire section.

Quote:
5-E-4-a Hotel suitability will be determined using a metric of “complaints per room night” using the API MyCrewCare website or similar successor software/website. The Company and the Association’s Hotel Committee will review all complaints and focus on the top five in the agreed upon ranking. On-site inspections will be arranged when needed or a replacement hotel will be sourced when both parties agree on such action.
“…a replacement hotel will be sourced when both parties agree on such action.” So the company can veto replacements in perpetuity. This section has no teeth and we’re not guaranteed anything better than we already have. Aside from Compensation and Scheduling, Hotels were in dire need of better language. It’s just not there. I still laugh when I think back to the company call where JO famously stated, “We’re within 1% of SkyWest’s hotel budget.”

I’ll continue echoing a popular sentiment. “We don’t stay where nobody else stays.”

Quote:
5-G-2 The Company will pay one-half (1/2) of the pilot's initial uniform cost for hat (if applicable), topcoat, jacket and two pair of trousers and one-half (1/2) of the cost for replacement of such items based upon reasonable wear.
Uniform needs to be paid for. Period. With annual stipends for upkeep.

Quote:
6-A-1 When pilots are required by the Company to deadhead to or from any station, each pilot will receive 62.5% of hourly flight pay at the applicable rate according to the status of the individual pilot for the scheduled time (block-to-block) of such deadhead. For the purposes of this paragraph, deadhead time shall include surface or air transportation.
Too low, not industry standard.

Quote:
7-C A week of vacation represents twenty-one (21) hours of flight pay.
Funny how a reserve calling in sick uses up 4 hours, yet vacation is only worth 3 hours a day. Our current contract is the same way and it only benefits the company.

Quote:
7-G The Company shall make vacation available for all (52) weeks of the year but reserves the right to limit available vacation slots to meet the needs of the service.
More faulty language borrowed from the last contract; management can unilaterally decide to have one vacation slot over Christmas and a whole bunch in other undesirable parts of the year. No need to cancel vacation when 90% of pilots can only get it during low flying times.

Quote:
7-M-2 Full (7 days) and partial weeks (4 to 6 days) are allowed.
7-M-2-a-(1) 6 days can only start on the 1st or 2nd day of the vacation period.
7-M-2-a-(2) 5 days can only start on the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd day of the vacation period.
7-M-2-a-(3) 4 days can only start on the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th day of the vacation period.
This is extremely limiting and restrictive in what you can get awarded. Need 3 days off the end of a week to lead into the next, or for a wedding, or to move, or just because? You’re SOL.

Quote:
11-I-1 Pilots with less than four (4) years longevity may be required to execute training agreements for their initial, upgrade or transition training. The Company will provide the pilot with a copy of the signed Training Agreement.
We cannot sanction training agreements. These are a slap in the face and no other regional does them. Instead of strong arming people to stay with financial coercion, Mesa should look at retention bonuses for every pilot like Endeavor and Air Wisconsin have. Or, you know, respectable pay rates.

Quote:
12-B Days Off
12-B-1 The minimum monthly days off for Regular line holders will be eleven (11) days in a month.
12-B-2 The minimum monthly days off for Reserve line holders will be eleven (11) days in a month.
Scheduling needed a major overhaul, but we’re still at our perpetual 11 days off with nothing else to show for it.

Quote:
13-C-11 Travel to training will be assigned by the company to all eligible pilots with an awarded training event. A pilot who is assigned travel will have the ability to cancel the travel for a training event no less than 5 days prior to the event. If a pilot fails to notify the Company that they do not need the provided travel the pilot will be responsible for any associated fees the Company incurs with all necessary documentation by the Company via payroll deduction.
The company can charge pilots if they don’t cancel travel? Seriously?

Quote:
13-K-17 Reserve Buffers
13-K-17-a The “Reserve Buffers” for a given month will be based on pilot absences, seasonality, and any other operational needs. This number may be adjusted daily.
13-K-17-b These buffers will not be set in excess of the above defined operational requirements.
13-K-17-c The Company shall provide the Association Scheduling Committee with the monthly calculations to establish the buffers above.
“Operational needs.” The company can still do whatever they want with buffers, they just have to come up with an explanation for ALPA now. Shouldn’t be too hard. I guess we’ll never have enough pilots to drop anything again, anyway.

Quote:
13-M-3 A reserve pilot placed on an “FDP-code” will be returned to reserve status and assignments will be made in accordance with Section 13-N of this Agreement.
Right now, FDP is not defined in our contract, and we’re better off that way. Because it isn’t defined, reserves are under no obligation to answer their phones when on it. Essentially, that means you’re released and you can go home. If the company really wanted to keep you on reserve following a flight, they could put you on Ready, but they don’t want to pay you. Seriously, ask your reps. To accept what the company has been trying to do for years is a major concession, and our pay rates need to go up significantly to even humor the idea.

Quote:
13-N-12 Reserve Pilots, upon returning from a flight assignment, may be contacted by Crew Scheduling. At the time of such contact, Crew Scheduling will assign the pilot an additional assignment, which will include:
13-N-12-a A flight assignment. or;
13-N-12-b Ready reserve. or;
13-N-12-c Remain on FDP and available for assignment. or;
13-N-12-d Release from further duty.
Release from further duty will never, ever happen. Why would they ever release you when they can now officially put you on FDP and be flush with free reserves every day? This is a major concession.

Quote:
13-N-15-d Reserve Assignments
13-N-15-d-(1) Pairings will be assigned according to the following criteria. When there are MULTIPLE pilots in a reserve bucket being considered, proceed to steps 2 and 3 to determine the most suitable reserve for the assignment.

13-N-15-d-(1)-(a) Step 1 - Reserve Buckets
- Long call reserves are utilized first in the same bucket, then to the next longer
bucket(s) (if they exist). Long Call will always be used prior to short call for trips
with a greater than 12 hour report time.
- Short call reserve in the same bucket, then to the next longer bucket(s).

13-N-15-d-(1)-(b) Step 2 - Duty and Rest Considerations
- Pilots with an RAP that begins closest to the report for duty time of the assignment.
- Pilots with an RAP that ends closest to the scheduled release from duty time.
- Any other FAR 117 cumulative or daily limitations that exceed predetermined
buffers.
13-N-15-d-(1)-(c) Once a pilot has been credited with 65 hours he will be bypassed until all other reserves in their category (bucket and position) hit 65 credit hours.

13-N-15-d-(1)-(d) Step 3 - Seniority will then be the final step used to determine the assignment.
- Call Me First (CMF): If multiple pilots are eligible for the assignment, it will be
assigned to the most senior Call Me First (CMF)
- Call Me Last (CML): If no CMF pilot is available, then to the most junior Call Me
Last (CML) in reverse seniority order.
13-N-15-d-(1)-(e) Pilots on ready reserve will be used at the discretion of the company to preserve operational integrity.
Just like TA15, Call Me First and Call Me Last are essentially gone. There goes seniority on reserve. The company can now bring everybody up to right below min guarantee then go to the next guy. Want to fly a lot? Nope. Want to fly as little as possible? Nope.

Quote:
13-N-17-b-(1) The Company will offer Long Call Reserve (LCR).
Long Call Reserve lines will be equal to at least 17% of the total amount of Reserve man days in each domicile, equipment and seat per bid period. If the calculation results in a number that is not a whole number, the result will be rounded down to the nearest whole number.
Long Call Reserve sounds nice until you realize only 17% get it.

Quote:
13-Q-1 When availability during a bid period is reduced due to Vacation, LOA, or other absences (Per Section 9), days off will be prorated subject to the following table:
In what world does having a week of vacation mean you just work more the rest of the month? 7 days vacation should equate to minimum 18 days off. We have the same problem now.

Quote:
23-C-1-a Beginning January 1, 2018, and annually thereafter on January 1, a number equaling one percent (1%) of the total pilot group shall be able to bid from one aircraft type to another, rounded up to the next whole number.
23-C-1-a-(1) Only Captains will be allowed to transfer equipment.
1% is anemic, pathetic, and not industry standard.

Quote:
23-H-1 No Equipment Commitments exist for First Officers, however, a First Officer shall only be allowed to bid into a higher paying position.
Again, not industry standard.

Quote:
24-A Insurance
We get killed on this compared to every other carrier, and there are no discernable changes. Enjoy paying more than everybody else while still getting paid less than everybody else.

Quote:
LOA 3 – Pilot Retention Bonus Programs

D. Effective upon Date of Signing the Company may develop pilot retention bonus programs that include:
1. All First Officers or;
2. All Captains or;
3. All Captains & First Officers
While this is distinct from JO’s unethical and unilateral new hire bonuses, these follow the same trends in allowing management to pay who they want when they want however much they want. Captains should expect to never see a dime. So much for unity, solidarity, and equity.

Quote:
LOA 4 – Use of Retired Pilots to Operate Part 91 Aircraft Repositioning Flights
The “Steve Trigg Clause.” We killed Freedom because our scope was threatened, and now we’re giving it away? Every Mesa flight needs to be operated by a Mesa Airlines line pilot. Anything else is outsourcing. Beyond that, why would we openly welcome Age 67+?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyler02 View Post
And I'll just leave this here . . .


Seniority List

2016
June - 1298
Sept -1267
October - 1258
November - 1231
2017
January - 1218
February - 1202
March - 1186
April - 1190
May - 1188
June - 1167

Shrinking with new A/C deliveries starting.
For the first time in Mesa Air Group’s history, management needs a deal more than we do. Let’s capitalize. Let’s set the bar higher. Let’s stop being the butt of jokes by other pilots. Let’s bring this place up to Industry Standard and keep the profession’s positive momentum going.

I appreciate the work done by our negotiators, and I think they may be the people to finish the job. But this isn’t it. We’re not across the finish line yet. Let’s stand together, send it back together, and get this thing done together. Let’s do it right.

Last edited by rickair7777; 06-27-2017 at 06:59 AM. Reason: User Request, Correct Details
deltajuliet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-2017, 02:47 PM   #2  
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I signed a CJO with Mesa for the E175 before the TA was announced, but I have not yet started class.

This will be my first 121 job so please forgive me if my question comes off as ignorant.

I understand what a B scale is, but do you mind clarifying what the DOSwill be for future pilots considering Mesa to know what their first year hourly pay might be.

Thank you!
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Old 06-24-2017, 03:26 PM   #3  
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DOS means Date of Signing. If this TA passed, that would be this summer. The way it's written, anyone hired after two years from that date would start at lower pay. You would be unaffected.

That being said, I still strongly encourage you to explore other regionals. As I pointed out in the first post, you will still be starting at the bottom of regional pay even if this thing passes. If it doesn't, $22/hour. Why put yourself through it? And this needs to be said: I've flown with countless new hires who came based on things Marcin told them that weren't true and never came true. If you're coming for the same reason, research and consider this decision very carefully.
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Old 06-24-2017, 03:27 PM   #4  
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Great analysis. I read the TA from cover to cover and thought I had pretty much understood it but your analysis brought so much more to light. I've been a no from the beginning but now I'm a strong no.

Reference the popular comment about hotels: can't remember where we were but we made it out to the hotel pickup area and a driver from a pretty nice hotel (can't remember the name) got out thinking we were his crew. Right behind us was a Skywest or Republic crew that got in the van. We were waiting for a Laquinta van. I hoped they would be long out of sight before the laquinta van pulled up. Nope. Here came the worn out van to pick us up. It was rather embarrassing. Felt like I was getting on the short bus when I was in school.
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Old 06-24-2017, 06:33 PM   #5  
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Wow, nice job deltajuliet. Very thorough. We'll see if a pay increase that is still below average is enough to sway pilots to look past the inadequacy of this TA.
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Old 06-25-2017, 05:31 AM   #6  
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Great write up and much appreciated. Even though it doesn't directly effect me, I feel like all the regionals are linked in terms of pilot benefits.

I hope this doesnt pass and you all get the contract you truly deserve.
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Old 06-25-2017, 06:12 AM   #7  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deltajuliet View Post
DOS means Date of Signing. If this TA passed, that would be this summer. The way it's written, anyone hired after two years from that date would start at lower pay. You would be unaffected.

That being said, I still strongly encourage you to explore other regionals. As I pointed out in the first post, you will still be starting at the bottom of regional pay even if this thing passes. If it doesn't, $22/hour. Why put yourself through it? And this needs to be said: I've flown with countless new hires who came based on things Marcin told them that weren't true and never came true. If you're coming for the same reason, research and consider this decision very carefully.
There are valid reasons for wanting to fly the Ejet for Mesa. First, a pilot might live in the Houston area. Second, a pilot may want to build Ejet time quickly to progress their career. Either of these are valid reasons to sign with Mesa on the Ejet. With either of these reasons, you may not care about the pay as much - except $36 is better than $22.
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Old 06-25-2017, 06:36 AM   #8  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmwinds View Post
There are valid reasons for wanting to fly the Ejet for Mesa. First, a pilot might live in the Houston area. Second, a pilot may want to build Ejet time quickly to progress their career. Either of these are valid reasons to sign with Mesa on the Ejet. With either of these reasons, you may not care about the pay as much - except $36 is better than $22.
Probably the dumbest excuse I have ever heard for deliberately going to the lowest paid carrier out there. Skywest, compass, envoy and republic also fly the ejet. Second there is no quantifiable days saying that the ejet magically makes you get hired elsewhere faster.
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Old 06-25-2017, 06:50 AM   #9  
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Originally Posted by FlyyGuyy View Post
Probably the dumbest excuse I have ever heard for deliberately going to the lowest paid carrier out there. Skywest, compass, envoy and republic also fly the ejet. Second there is no quantifiable days saying that the ejet magically makes you get hired elsewhere faster.
Which of these fly an Ejet out of Houston? Zero. Zip. Nada. Go with SW on the Ejet to sit on reserve in Chicago and take 3 years to upgrade to sit on reserve again. Unless you go with SW on the Ejet for a west coast base, then you sit on reserve in Chicago for months, to transfer to the West coast, to sit on reserve for many more months, to wait years to upgrade.

Pretty rare to get the Ejet on Envoy unless you are in your 50's. Republic doesn't just give you the Ejet either.

While I agree there is nothing magical about the Ejet getting you hired on with a major, there are pilots that want to fly it. Most majors simply want the 121 time and a decent internal reference.
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Old 06-25-2017, 07:02 AM   #10  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmwinds View Post

While I agree there is nothing magical about the Ejet getting you hired on with a major, there are pilots that want to fly it.
But...But, they're so SHINY!!
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Comair Pilots Voting on Agreement RockBottom Regional 3 06-05-2008 04:44 PM
Real Time Access to LOA Voting Results? DLax85 Cargo 9 08-05-2007 06:07 PM


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