Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums - Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ. Join our community today and start interacting with existing members. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free.


User Tag List

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-15-2020, 09:48 PM   #1  
Layover Master
Thread Starter
 
PotatoChip's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,471
Default Active Duty

Quick question:
Can you join active duty and keep your seniority number at an airline?
Speaking from a non-prior joining perspective. Or does that only work if going reserve?
Thanks.
PotatoChip is offline  
Old 03-15-2020, 10:02 PM   #2  
Gets Weekends Off
 
RemiDenton's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Posts: 199
Default

USERRA only holds protections for up to 5 years accumulative. Iím not sure about jointing after you have the gig but thatís a big factor regardless.
RemiDenton is offline  
Old 03-15-2020, 10:10 PM   #3  
Layover Master
Thread Starter
 
PotatoChip's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,471
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RemiDenton View Post
USERRA only holds protections for up to 5 years accumulative. Iím not sure about jointing after you have the gig but thatís a big factor regardless.
Right, Iíve seen that.
So sake of argument, one gets commissioned and has a four year commitment. Then separates and goes back.
No probs.
But itís cutting it tight.
PotatoChip is offline  
Old 03-15-2020, 10:11 PM   #4  
Gets Weekends Off
 
RemiDenton's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Posts: 199
Default

... donít take this the wrong way. But in a pilot forum... are you talking about enlisting or commissioning? And if you commission are you not trying to fly?

If you fly you will have a contract a lot longer than 4 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RemiDenton is offline  
Old 03-15-2020, 10:13 PM   #5  
Layover Master
Thread Starter
 
PotatoChip's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,471
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RemiDenton View Post
... donít take this the wrong way. But in a pilot forum... are you talking about enlisting or commissioning? And if you commission are you not trying to fly?

If you fly you will have a contract a lot longer than 4 years.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Commissioning. Non-pilot MOS.
PotatoChip is offline  
Old 03-15-2020, 10:33 PM   #6  
Prime Minister/Moderator
 
rickair7777's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 24,873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RemiDenton View Post
USERRA only holds protections for up to 5 years accumulative. I’m not sure about jointing after you have the gig but that’s a big factor regardless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PotatoChip View Post
Right, I’ve seen that.
So sake of argument, one gets commissioned and has a four year commitment. Then separates and goes back.
No probs.
But it’s cutting it tight.
This is very wrong, and also a very common misconception.

The five year limit ONLY counts active duty which is totally voluntary and discretionary, and is also not in support of major contingency operations. It also does not count guard/reserve routine training.

USERRA was enacted to protect guard/reserve but also applies to regular active duty.

These types of active duty are exempt from the five year limit, and this list is not exhaustive...

1. AD for initial training. This can be years, if the skillset requires that (typical for pilots).
2. Any initial AD obligation incurred. Initial AD obligation is typically at least 3-4 years.
3. AD performing any additional training.
4. Any AD obligation incurred for said training.
5. Any service in, or in support of, major contingency operations. Until recently many guard and most reserve AD orders fell under this.
5. Any routine guard/reserve training (not limited to one weekend/two weeks, just has to be mandated by your unit).

So you can join the guard/reserves, do several years of AD for initial training, then monthly/annual training to 20 years, and retire without touching one day of your five-year limit.

It's also possible to do 20 years on regular AD... the first ten+ is typically all obligated anyway if you're a pilot, and you get five years of voluntary service. That gets you to 15. Somewhere in there if you do a lengthy school with a service obligation, then that would get you another five obligated. A two-year masters program with a three year payback obligation would do it.

Don't worry about the five years limit unless you want to do 20 years AD, or are in the reserves and want to do a lot of volunteer orders. New members can disregard any five-year limit issues, it doesn't apply at that point
rickair7777 is online now  
Old 03-17-2020, 06:01 AM   #7  
Layover Master
Thread Starter
 
PotatoChip's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,471
Default

Thanks, Rick. That makes sense. Iím trying to read through the actual document.
Iím going to talk with HR as well to see if they see it this way as well. Getting some ducks in a row.
PotatoChip is offline  
Old 03-17-2020, 06:10 AM   #8  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 442
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PotatoChip View Post
Thanks, Rick. That makes sense. Iím trying to read through the actual document.
Iím going to talk with HR as well to see if they see it this way as well. Getting some ducks in a row.
Iíd talk to the mil affairs committee and leave HR out of it, personally. I donít think ours are experts or otherwise very knowledgeable about mil leave, hence why they outsource it to Sedgwick to handle. And those guys are clueless when I talked to them about it.
jamesholzhauer is offline  
Old 03-17-2020, 06:21 AM   #9  
Layover Master
Thread Starter
 
PotatoChip's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,471
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesholzhauer View Post
Iíd talk to the mil affairs committee and leave HR out of it, personally. I donít think ours are experts or otherwise very knowledgeable about mil leave, hence why they outsource it to Sedgwick to handle. And those guys are clueless when I talked to them about it.
Good intel, thanks. Will do.
PotatoChip is offline  
Old 03-17-2020, 06:48 AM   #10  
Prime Minister/Moderator
 
rickair7777's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 24,873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PotatoChip View Post
Thanks, Rick. That makes sense. Iím trying to read through the actual document.
Iím going to talk with HR as well to see if they see it this way as well. Getting some ducks in a row.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesholzhauer View Post
Iíd talk to the mil affairs committee and leave HR out of it, personally. I donít think ours are experts or otherwise very knowledgeable about mil leave, hence why they outsource it to Sedgwick to handle. And those guys are clueless when I talked to them about it.
This.

Many HR depts are either grossly ignorant of the (complicated and nuanced) rules, or are willfully pushing boundaries and grey areas to intimidate and discourage participation.

Never ask HR. Get the right answer and then tell HR what you're doing.

Some companies try to force you to "request" mil leave and get "approval". You don't have to play that game, you can simply email scheduling (cc your CP) notifying them of what you're doing (with reasonable lead time). But play their game if on probation.
rickair7777 is online now  
 
 
 

 
Post Reply
 



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? Guard Dude Delta 198944 03-26-2020 03:13 PM
Sanctuary and USERRA WarEagle28 Military 18 02-07-2018 07:39 AM
Recalling Active Duty Air Force Pilots Patches FedEx 22 10-25-2017 07:52 PM
Are overseas regional airlines just as bad n287hg Regional 35 10-12-2009 06:40 AM
military or civilian route? N261ND Flight Schools and Training 22 09-12-2008 07:57 PM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:53 AM.