Brillo

Hello all,

New member here. Great info.

I'm a USMC V-22 guy and was looking to get some opinions or knowledge from anyone about what the airlines might be doing with regard to tiltrotor time. I found a bit of info on APC, but the latest was from a couple of years ago. Maybe someone's heard something more recent.

I know it's in its own class (powered lift). I assume that it will vary from airline to airline, and that due to it's relative newness and the fact that airlines probably haven't really had to deal with this issue that there aren't any set policies, but maybe someone has heard some discussions.

I have a feeling for a while we'll be in this area where helo guys don't really consider it helicopter time and fixed wing carriers don't really consider it multi-engine fixed time. Maybe it will take someone getting in somewhere and educating people.

The argument for counting the time would be that we routinely perform rolling take-offs and landings and fly as a fixed wing aircraft about 90% of the time. We spend considerable time navigating the IFR route structure at airplane altitudes/airspeeds and pretty much act and are treated as an airplane most of the time. We also fly a glass cockpit, FMS equipped, multi-crewed platform. Routinely fly IFR and deal with icing, weather, etc.

The arguments against would be that we do spend time flying like helos and don't really deal with assymetric thrust issues on a routine basis (that would be bad). We do train it in flight school on C-12's (around 75 hours worth or so).

Anybody hear it discussed? Thanks, and please don't hesitate to hit me up if you want to know anything about Ospreys or USMC flying in general. I'll do my best to answer any questions anyone might have.

JamesNoBrakes

Almost no one deals with asymmetric thrust on a routine basis in the real world, especially at airlines. You train for it, but it's exceptionally rare (yes, 5 guys will pop up and say they've had engine failures, but I think you'll find the majority have not). This is question best posed to the airline you intend to apply to. I'm not sure it would be thought of as dishonest to plug it as fixed wing time in a form, since you do have a fixed wing (just movable engines). Just explain when you get called or come in for the interview what it is. Most departments aren't looking to eliminate people that badly, especially ones with actual experience.

CRM114

The problem you have is with the FAA in that you'll need an ATP-Airplane rating in order to be qualified to work for an airline. If you can get that flying the C-12 or similar you'll be golden as you funky-lift time will be icing on the cake.

I'd start at the local FISDO and see if they'd be willing to MIL competency ATP-Airplane given your experience. I haven't looked at the ATP-PTS in a while so I don't even know if it's addressed.

Brillo

Thanks for the responses.

I've got in the neighborhood of 200 or so hours in T-34's and C-12's from flight school, so I could get the extra 50 or so hours flying airplanes in my off time (correct me if I'm wrong, but ATP-Airplane requires 250 hours in airplanes). I'd essentially be looking at being a guy with 250 airplane hours, around 2500 tiltrotor hours, and a few other things like Aviation Safety Officer, CFI/CFII, NATOPS Instructor (like a Stan-I) and a few other military "I" quals.

I guess that would be the crux of it. I could get up to the minimums for ATP in airplanes, but then the bulk of my experience would be tiltrotors.

Toonces

Brillo, once you get those last 50 hrs in airplanes (and that is 250 hrs PIC, not just airplane), as well as the other random ATP requirements, every regional will be glad to take you. With your amount of fixed wing time and total time, you could also get a job at some entry level SIC 135 operators. You probably already know this, but you will have an impressive resume, with hardly anyone who appreciates it. Once you have an actual fixed wing job under your belt (civilian or military), you will be much more marketable. Multi-crew, advanced cockpit, IFR experience is the selling point.

I didn't mention helicopter jobs anywhere in this thread. If you get a CFII-H, you may get an instructor job. Once you have 1500 hrs PIC in a helicopter only, then you will be eligible for anything else...maybe.

Brillo

Toones, thanks for the info. For a minute I thought you were a Toonces from one of my old squadrons.

I didn't really mention helos too much because I think the tiltrotor time actually makes me a better fixed wing pilot than a helicopter pilot. We always like to portray the platform as an airplane than can land vertically, not a fast helicopter.

Your comment about having a decent resume but no one to appreciate it strikes true. I wish sometimes we could have a chief pilot or two ride along with us on a cross country. I flew out of JFK a couple of days ago, mixed in with some heavies, and I definitely felt like a fixed wing guy.

I'll keep working towards building my experience base and see what the future holds.

deadstick35

ATP MEL is going to get tricky in a couple of months.

Brillo

I heard that. Everyone is telling me to get the written knocked out before then. Any benefit to that in your opinion?

L'il J.Seinfeld

To be honest....you're stretching. Maybe a regional will take you, but a legacy will view you as a helo guy.

ron kent

I know a ton of AV-8 guys have been hired by the majors and all their flight time counted. They don't land "normal" either.