Should I leave ZW for PDT or Commutair?
02-05-2016, 07:23 PM
#111
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Posts: 841
I would agree with that as well.
02-05-2016, 07:59 PM
#112
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 391
Originally Posted by MKUltra
Hey I like all you awac guys and have had some great conversations with you guys and girls in the Phl crew room. I have a large amount of respect.
What I don't know, if pdt can staff all the flying that is expected of us. There just isn't enough pilots and our training dept need some steroids to get to this thing up to "800" pilots. PDT has a lot of senior guys close to retirement or who are having medical issues. We are losing people to other carriers and cargo operators. That's only going to exasperate staffing, but movement will be rapid.
AWAC is an established pilot group and equipment that is valuable in this market. I hope they stay strong and demand a high price for their service. I am sure Delta wishes they had their services now. This only raises the bar for each and everyone of us in our wallet for being a professional pilot.
I honestly can't see pdt or any of the wholly owns to be successful in growth right now unless they raise the amount of compensation in order to attract pilots in order to staff the regional lift they have.
I also don't see the 50 seat lift going anywhere, but what do I know, I push buttons and pull levers.
What I don't know, if pdt can staff all the flying that is expected of us. There just isn't enough pilots and our training dept need some steroids to get to this thing up to "800" pilots. PDT has a lot of senior guys close to retirement or who are having medical issues. We are losing people to other carriers and cargo operators. That's only going to exasperate staffing, but movement will be rapid.
AWAC is an established pilot group and equipment that is valuable in this market. I hope they stay strong and demand a high price for their service. I am sure Delta wishes they had their services now. This only raises the bar for each and everyone of us in our wallet for being a professional pilot.
I honestly can't see pdt or any of the wholly owns to be successful in growth right now unless they raise the amount of compensation in order to attract pilots in order to staff the regional lift they have.
I also don't see the 50 seat lift going anywhere, but what do I know, I push buttons and pull levers.
02-05-2016, 08:04 PM
#113
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: PNF
Posts: 622
Exacerbate ...
02-05-2016, 08:07 PM
#114
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,450
Originally Posted by MKUltra
Hey I like all you awac guys and have had some great conversations with you guys and girls in the Phl crew room. I have a large amount of respect.
What I don't know, if pdt can staff all the flying that is expected of us. There just isn't enough pilots and our training dept need some steroids to get to this thing up to "800" pilots. PDT has a lot of senior guys close to retirement or who are having medical issues. We are losing people to other carriers and cargo operators. That's only going to exasperate staffing, but movement will be rapid.
AWAC is an established pilot group and equipment that is valuable in this market. I hope they stay strong and demand a high price for their service. I am sure Delta wishes they had their services now. This only raises the bar for each and everyone of us in our wallet for being a professional pilot.
I honestly can't see pdt or any of the wholly owns to be successful in growth right now unless they raise the amount of compensation in order to attract pilots in order to staff the regional lift they have.
I also don't see the 50 seat lift going anywhere, but what do I know, I push buttons and pull levers.
What I don't know, if pdt can staff all the flying that is expected of us. There just isn't enough pilots and our training dept need some steroids to get to this thing up to "800" pilots. PDT has a lot of senior guys close to retirement or who are having medical issues. We are losing people to other carriers and cargo operators. That's only going to exasperate staffing, but movement will be rapid.
AWAC is an established pilot group and equipment that is valuable in this market. I hope they stay strong and demand a high price for their service. I am sure Delta wishes they had their services now. This only raises the bar for each and everyone of us in our wallet for being a professional pilot.
I honestly can't see pdt or any of the wholly owns to be successful in growth right now unless they raise the amount of compensation in order to attract pilots in order to staff the regional lift they have.
I also don't see the 50 seat lift going anywhere, but what do I know, I push buttons and pull levers.
I do agree it will be a big challenge for Piedmont to double in size with a new fleet and a flow that keeps taking experienced pilots each month. Instructors included in those leaving will also hurt. Remember once they get someone to become a instructor they are gone in 1 or 2 years.
That being said they are filling classes with other 121 airline pilots now and will soon use people from other RJ carriers to become instructors. Kinda like how PSA used former Comair pilots to help in there training.
Yes AWAC is an established group but it's funny when you say, "I'm sure Delta wishes it had its services now." What makes you say that? All Delta has to do is pick up the phone and work out a deal if they wanted to right? So far AWAC doesn't have a partner and I'm sure they'd love to work out a deal with Delta or United (however two bad experiences with United might have already ended any future deals there). Plus I'm sure any new deal will have to come with a new fixed cost. That road was tried once and didn't work out.
So you think a contract carrier is safer then a Wo'ed in this environment? The 3 Wo's at American will only be as successful as Parker wants them. American has tons of cash to throw at any of them. Being backed by the largest airline in the world isn't a bad deal in this market.
50 seat aircraft are less likely at United and Delta then American. Delta just ordered 190's and are looking at taking more flying back within the mainline operation. United is also looking at a big order of 190's to keep the flying. This is a win win for all the regionals as more mainline jobs will open up.
I think the future will be bright for everyone soon.
02-05-2016, 09:11 PM
#115
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
Originally Posted by billyho
Let's see. First you're correct that AWAC is good pilot group. They been around for a long time and have also been a solid performer just like a few other airlines out there.
I do agree it will be a big challenge for Piedmont to double in size with a new fleet and a flow that keeps taking experienced pilots each month. Instructors included in those leaving will also hurt. Remember once they get someone to become a instructor they are gone in 1 or 2 years.
That being said they are filling classes with other 121 airline pilots now and will soon use people from other RJ carriers to become instructors. Kinda like how PSA used former Comair pilots to help in there training.
Yes AWAC is an established group but it's funny when you say, "I'm sure Delta wishes it had its services now." What makes you say that? All Delta has to do is pick up the phone and work out a deal if they wanted to right? So far AWAC doesn't have a partner and I'm sure they'd love to work out a deal with Delta or United (however two bad experiences with United might have already ended any future deals there). Plus I'm sure any new deal will have to come with a new fixed cost. That road was tried once and didn't work out.
So you think a contract carrier is safer then a Wo'ed in this environment? The 3 Wo's at American will only be as successful as Parker wants them. American has tons of cash to throw at any of them. Being backed by the largest airline in the world isn't a bad deal in this market.
50 seat aircraft are less likely at United and Delta then American. Delta just ordered 190's and are looking at taking more flying back within the mainline operation. United is also looking at a big order of 190's to keep the flying. This is a win win for all the regionals as more mainline jobs will open up.
I think the future will be bright for everyone soon.
I do agree it will be a big challenge for Piedmont to double in size with a new fleet and a flow that keeps taking experienced pilots each month. Instructors included in those leaving will also hurt. Remember once they get someone to become a instructor they are gone in 1 or 2 years.
That being said they are filling classes with other 121 airline pilots now and will soon use people from other RJ carriers to become instructors. Kinda like how PSA used former Comair pilots to help in there training.
Yes AWAC is an established group but it's funny when you say, "I'm sure Delta wishes it had its services now." What makes you say that? All Delta has to do is pick up the phone and work out a deal if they wanted to right? So far AWAC doesn't have a partner and I'm sure they'd love to work out a deal with Delta or United (however two bad experiences with United might have already ended any future deals there). Plus I'm sure any new deal will have to come with a new fixed cost. That road was tried once and didn't work out.
So you think a contract carrier is safer then a Wo'ed in this environment? The 3 Wo's at American will only be as successful as Parker wants them. American has tons of cash to throw at any of them. Being backed by the largest airline in the world isn't a bad deal in this market.
50 seat aircraft are less likely at United and Delta then American. Delta just ordered 190's and are looking at taking more flying back within the mainline operation. United is also looking at a big order of 190's to keep the flying. This is a win win for all the regionals as more mainline jobs will open up.
I think the future will be bright for everyone soon.
02-05-2016, 09:57 PM
#116
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,450
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
If Parker has so much cash to throw at his Wo's, why are they still some of the lowest paid in the industry? He could just pick up the phone and change all that... Sorry but I'm not buying what you're selling. Your arguments are very carefully one-sided.
Believe me if he needs to throw more money at them he will.
Why don't you think AWAC didn't get locked into a long term deal? I bet you it was because of cost.
It Is what it is. How is the argument one-sided?
02-06-2016, 03:16 AM
#117
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 10,066
Originally Posted by billyho
It's easy to answer. It's because we are now cheaper then the contract carriers. It's the only reason the WO's are growing. If the WO's can do the flying cheaper it's a win win for American.
Believe me if he needs to throw more money at them he will.
Why don't you think AWAC didn't get locked into a long term deal? I bet you it was because of cost.
It Is what it is. How is the argument one-sided?
Believe me if he needs to throw more money at them he will.
Why don't you think AWAC didn't get locked into a long term deal? I bet you it was because of cost.
It Is what it is. How is the argument one-sided?
02-06-2016, 04:04 AM
#118
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Posts: 599
what am I reading...? ...a transcript of the View? Bunch of old ladies bickering. Now I understand why China censors those who speak out. If I was a moderator I would censor 90% of you for speaking blasphemy lol
02-06-2016, 07:08 AM
#119
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
Originally Posted by ChipChelios
what am I reading...? ...a transcript of the View? Bunch of old ladies bickering. Now I understand why China censors those who speak out. If I was a moderator I would censor 90% of you for speaking blasphemy lol
but hopefully this is somewhat on topic..billy being cheapest only works if you can staff. Imho it seems like they'd rather hire us to cover what can't be staffed than pay the WOs more to cover it themselves. AA will fly them as cheap as they can for as long as they can. I assume the bottom line is better for them this way. With all the staffing difficulties out there I'd dare to say ZW won't have trouble finding work for quite a while. Hopefully they'll find something and decide to announce it before Jan 2018....
02-06-2016, 07:53 AM
#120
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,450
Originally Posted by CBreezy
But you're not cheaper. Contract carriers like TSA is cheaper because their seniority list is super junior and their administrative infrastructure is bare bones.
Do you honestly believe if the contract carriers were cheaper today that Parker wouldn't have gone with them? That's the reason Envoy went through it's hell in getting the cost structure to compete with other 175 operators.
If I'm not mistaken I think United bought into the CommutAir. It's to the point now that the Majors are switching to bringing more of the flying in house.
And this will be a good thing for EVERYONE.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
